[{"data":1,"prerenderedAt":37815},["ShallowReactive",2],{"\u002Fpodcast\u002Fnews-22-26-bun-rewrite-in-rust-erwartungen-an-ai-labs-apple-design-awards":3},{"podcast":4,"pickOfTheDayCount":81,"speakerCount":82,"relatedPodcasts":83,"transcript":84},{"id":5,"published_on":6,"type":7,"number":8,"title":9,"slug":10,"description":11,"transcript":12,"audio_url":13,"apple_url":12,"google_url":12,"spotify_url":12,"cover_image":14,"banner_image":12,"speakers":26,"members":27,"picks_of_the_day":77,"tags":78,"tagsPrepared":79,"speakersPrepared":80},"c4aa203f-ef42-4b81-8beb-f47259a62ea1","2026-05-28T04:00:00.000Z","news","22\u002F26","Bun Rewrite in Rust \u002F\u002F Erwartungen an AI Labs \u002F\u002F Apple Design Awards","news-22-26-bun-rewrite-in-rust-erwartungen-an-ai-labs-apple-design-awards","\u003Cp>Eigentlich sollte diese Folge eine kurze Sommerloch-Ausgabe werden. Stattdessen landen wir in einer Diskussion über AI, Ethik, Kapitalismus und die Frage, warum AI-Unternehmen gefühlt immer als Held starten und irgendwann doch zum Bösewicht werden.\u003C\u002Fp>\n\u003Cp>Das gesamte Bun-Projekt wurde innerhalb weniger Tage \u003Ca href=\"https:\u002F\u002Fgithub.com\u002Foven-sh\u002Fbun\u002Fpull\u002F30412\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">mit Hilfe von AI von Zig nach Rust portiert\u003C\u002Fa>. Millionen neue Zeilen Code, tausende geänderte Dateien und eine Community, die gleichzeitig beeindruckt und maximal skeptisch reagiert. Wir sprechen darüber, warum solche Rewrites plötzlich wirtschaftlich sinnvoll werden, und ob AI-gestützte Migrationen künftig ganz normaler Entwicklungsalltag werden könnten – und was Microsoft damit zu tun hat.\u003C\u002Fp>\n\u003Cp>Danach wird’s grundsätzlicher: Wie moralisch sind AI-Unternehmen eigentlich noch? Von OpenAI über Anthropic bis Mistral AI reden wir darüber, warum viele Labs mit idealistischen Visionen starten und am Ende doch wieder auf an knallharter Marktlogik treffen. Dabei geht es nicht darum, AI grundsätzlich schlechtzureden, sondern vielmehr um die Frage, wie viel Vertrauen man Unternehmen entgegenbringen möchte, die gleichzeitig „die Zukunft der Menschheit“ bauen.\u003C\u002Fp>\n\u003Cp>Dennis bringt die diesjährigen \u003Ca href=\"https:\u002F\u002Fdeveloper.apple.com\u002Fdesign\u002Fawards\u002F\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Apple Design Award Finalisten\u003C\u002Fa> mit und wir sprechen darüber, warum diese Apps oft weniger wie klassische Software und mehr wie kleine Showcase-Projekte für das gesamte Apple-Ökosystem wirken. Dabei geht es um kreative Interfaces, ungewöhnliche Ideen und die Frage, warum manche Apps sich einfach „anders cool“ anfühlen.\u003C\u002Fp>\n\u003Cp>Und weil bei uns organisatorische Entscheidungen grundsätzlich am besten spontan passieren, entsteht während der Folge auch noch direkt ein Gewinnspiel: Wer die Gewinner:innen der Apple Design Awards richtig tippt, kann ein Ticket für die programmier.con gewinnen. Sendet eure Tipps vor Verkündung der Gewinner-Apps und -Games an \u003Ca href=\"mailto:podcast@programmier.bar\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">podcast@programmier.bar\u003C\u002Fa>. Alle Teilnahmebedingungen findet ihr unter \u003Ca href=\"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.programmier.bar\u002Fgewinnspiel\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\u002F\u002Fwww.programmier.bar\u002Fgewinnspiel\u003C\u002Fa>\u003C\u002Fp>\n\u003Cp>Außerdem entscheiden wir während der Aufnahme, dass wir auch dieses Jahr wieder \u003Ca href=\"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.programmier.bar\u002Fmeetup\u002Fwwdc26-watch-party\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">eine gemeinsame WWDC-Watchparty\u003C\u002Fa> veranstalten. Am 8. Juni 2026 schauen wir gemeinsam Apples große Entwicklungskonferenz und diskutieren die Ankündigungen direkt im Anschluss in einer Podcast-Folge. Seid dabei und meldet euch jetzt an!\u003C\u002Fp>",null,"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.buzzsprout.com\u002F176239\u002Fepisodes\u002F19248641-news-22-26-bun-rewrite-in-rust-erwartungen-an-ai-labs-apple-design-awards.mp3",{"id":15,"title":16,"description":12,"tags":12,"location":12,"filename_disk":17,"filename_download":18,"metadata":19,"type":20,"filesize":21,"modified_by":12,"modified_on":22,"embed":12,"uploaded_by":23,"uploaded_on":24,"folder":12,"width":25,"height":25,"charset":12,"duration":12},"a85b4821-cbf4-4722-88a8-fe2fe94ea51c","News Asset 22","a85b4821-cbf4-4722-88a8-fe2fe94ea51c.jpg","News-Asset 22.jpg",{},"image\u002Fjpeg","1262970","2026-05-27T09:18:03.155Z","11a655b6-bcfc-4c6c-a13c-68189e38edb9","2026-05-27T09:18:03.151Z",1500,[],[28,46,61],{"member":29},{"id":30,"first_name":31,"last_name":32,"occupation":33,"description":34,"normal_image":35},"47099351-508c-44d9-a2a2-855181c72ee8","Jan Gregor","Emge-Triebel","\u002F\u002F programmier.bar Tech Community Lead \u002F\u002F Podcast-Host","\u003Cp>Jan ist ein echter Technik-Fan mit einer facettenreichen Karriere, die sich über Web-, Mobile-App-Entwicklung und DevOps erstreckt. Dank seiner vielfältigen Rollen – vom Entwickler über den Teamleiter bis hin zum Vice President Development – verfügt Jan über einen großen Erfahrungsschatz in der Softwareentwicklung und Developer Advocacy.\u003Cbr>Seine Leidenschaften jenseits der Technik reichen von Tauchgängen an exotischen Orten über das Eintauchen in digitale wie analoge Spiele bis hin zum Abtauchen in gelungene Plot-Twists in Büchern und Filmen.\u003C\u002Fp>",{"id":36,"title":37,"description":12,"tags":12,"location":12,"filename_disk":38,"filename_download":39,"metadata":40,"type":20,"filesize":41,"modified_by":12,"modified_on":42,"embed":12,"uploaded_by":43,"uploaded_on":44,"folder":12,"width":45,"height":45,"charset":12,"duration":12},"ef7c0ccb-a2b5-48a0-8261-c8bbfffd917b","Jan CD","ef7c0ccb-a2b5-48a0-8261-c8bbfffd917b.jpg","Jan_CD.jpg",{},"649400","2024-07-26T09:26:17.846Z","e97179d2-51b3-4deb-828f-9524091441f5","2024-07-26T09:26:17.710Z",1024,{"member":47},{"id":48,"first_name":49,"last_name":50,"occupation":51,"description":52,"normal_image":53},"958f6624-c721-4ff9-8a97-69148f540945","Dennis","Becker","\u002F\u002F Podcast-Host","\u003Cp>Dennis ist Head of Development bei Lotum und kümmert sich liebevoll um die Entwickler:innen und deren Weiterentwicklung. \u003Cbr>In den Podcastfolgen übernimmt Dennis gerne die Moderation. Beim täglichen Tischtennis ist er immer am Start und seit wenigen Jahren passionierter Kitesurfer. Mittlerweile ist er auch Vibe Coder mit Leidenschaft und überzeugt, dass seine Kolleg:innen AI unterschätzen. \u003C\u002Fp>",{"id":54,"title":55,"description":12,"tags":12,"location":12,"filename_disk":56,"filename_download":57,"metadata":12,"type":20,"filesize":58,"modified_by":12,"modified_on":59,"embed":12,"uploaded_by":12,"uploaded_on":60,"folder":12,"width":45,"height":45,"charset":12,"duration":12},"7a9fd72e-16b1-4283-8c1f-348a3e7986f9","Dennis Becker","7a9fd72e-16b1-4283-8c1f-348a3e7986f9.jpg","dennis_becker_normal_01e352e682.jpg","45729","2022-01-16T14:26:35.196Z","2021-12-30T14:16:28.647Z",{"member":62},{"id":63,"first_name":64,"last_name":65,"occupation":66,"description":67,"normal_image":68},"11d2e9b0-4443-4287-96bc-3930b0ada739","Dave","Koschitzki","\u002F\u002F Website \u002F\u002F Podcast-Host","\u003Cp>Dave ist seit 2024 Mitglied des programmier.bar-Teams. Neben seiner Arbeit an der Website-Entwicklung bringt er frischen Wind in den Podcast und ist regelmäßig bei Meetups anzutreffen. Seine Leidenschaft für Games, die er sowohl auf der Konsole als auch am PC spielt, ist unübersehbar.\u003Cbr> \u003Cbr>Wenn er nicht gerade in virtuelle Welten eintaucht, trifft man ihn im Fitnessstudio, wo er mit Begeisterung Gewichte stemmt. Dave bereichert das Team nicht nur durch seine technischen Fähigkeiten, sondern auch durch seine vielseitigen Interessen und ansteckende Energie.\u003C\u002Fp>",{"id":69,"title":70,"description":12,"tags":12,"location":12,"filename_disk":71,"filename_download":72,"metadata":73,"type":20,"filesize":74,"modified_by":12,"modified_on":75,"embed":12,"uploaded_by":43,"uploaded_on":76,"folder":12,"width":45,"height":45,"charset":12,"duration":12},"578c2a0f-e919-4668-9cb4-f5b97252d57f","Dave CD","578c2a0f-e919-4668-9cb4-f5b97252d57f.jpg","Dave_CD.jpg",{},"675668","2024-07-29T14:46:16.725Z","2024-07-29T14:46:16.613Z",[],[],[],[],470,197,[],{"id":85,"service":86,"supported_features":87,"speakers":90,"raw_response":98},"f37c510c-218f-4776-9387-4de2bb37eba9","deepgram",[88,89],"timestamps","diarization",[91,94,96],{"identifier":92,"name":93},"0","Jan",{"identifier":95,"name":49},"1",{"identifier":97,"name":64},"2",{"metadata":99,"results":113},{"transaction_key":100,"request_id":101,"sha256":102,"created":103,"duration":104,"channels":105,"models":106,"model_info":108},"deprecated","019e69f7-af61-7860-b77e-9059657c913d","2bb409ca8cac63cbf5db8c35f78fcea22800449e9419454e73cabab3bc4f5ad2","2026-05-27T15:05:08.793Z",2791.4316,1,[107],"91f8eabe-2126-4ed4-9e56-d480032309b3",{"91f8eabe-2126-4ed4-9e56-d480032309b3":109},{"name":110,"version":111,"arch":112},"2-general-nova","2024-05-09.3071","nova-2",{"channels":114,"utterances":26897},[115],{"alternatives":116},[117],{"transcript":118,"confidence":119,"words":120,"paragraphs":24709},"Hallo und herzlich willkommen zu den Programmierball News heute in Kalenderwoche 22. Hab ich natürlich gewusst und bin vollkommen vorbereitet. Ich bin der, ich muss das jetzt hier wieder richtig sagen, Jan Gregor Engetriebel wurde mir gesagt und mit mir im Studio sitzen, Dennis Becker. Oh, das ist für einfach ganz toll. Komplett backert, Alter. Aber ich dachte, d ist voll weit vorne. Ja, aber d, genau d ist voll weit vorne, aber d a ist näher als d e. Ja, das ist nicht, dass ich der Obst war und nicht vorher vorher. Stimmt, das ist crazy. Also warte mal, wer ist sie, Dennis Becker? Dennis Becker. Und auch noch Dave Acker, Dave Krusitzky Acker, der sommerliche Boy. Yes. Mal kurz festhalten, dass wenn ich einmal richtiges Intro mach, ihr es verkackt habt, so, ne? Ja. Ja, aber das liegt auch daran, dass Du's dir erst mal richtig gemacht hast. Das hab ich mich drauf eingestellt. Vollkommen ausm Konzept gebracht. Außer Intros wollen wir heute besprechen, was es bei Bun Neues gibt. Wir rannten ein bisschen über AI und Dennis hat zu guter Letzt noch die Apple Design Awards dabei, beziehungsweise ich glaub, die Finalisten erst oder so was, gell? Die Finalisten, ja. Die Finalisten. Denn die WWDC kommt ja erst am Irgendwo, September oder? Juni. Achtter oder zehnter Juni oder so was. Montags. Speaking of WWDC. Dennis, Du hast da News dazu, hab ich gehört. Echt? Haben wir uns entschieden? Cool. Oh, wirklich. Du kannst das jetzt quasi live on air entscheiden. Du kannst das live entscheiden. Ja, wir hatten das, ich glaub, vorletztes Jahr, ich bin mir gar nicht sicher, ob wir das letztes Jahr auch angeboten haben. Nee, nee. Da meinte er nicht, nee. Wir haben ja sone Tradition, dass wir die WWWDC Keynote gar nicht jetzt gemeinsam gucken und danach eine Podcastfolge darauf aufnehmen und dazu aufnehmen und uns Hast Du gesagt, dass wir sie nicht gemeinsam gucken? Nein, wir gucken sie. Ah, wir gucken sie gemeinsam. Ich sag, also das Tradition ist, wie sie nicht gemeinsam gucken. Okay, ja. Und vor 2 Jahren haben wir dazu auf eingeladen, andere Programmierhörer*innen da draußen oder Programmierbar Fans einfach, dass die dazukommen können und mittels gucken können. Und das machen wir dieses Jahr jetzt einfach wieder. Wir bestellen ein bisschen Essen, je nachdem, wie viele Leute da sind, gibt's 'n bisschen was zu snacken, Getränke haben wir sowieso immer hier und dann gucken wir das ganze Ding danach. Machen wir noch schnell eine Live Podcast Folge und nehmen nehmen It's a Rap in knapper Stunde zusammengefasst, was 2 Stunden Präsentationen bei uns hätten auch zeigen können. Also ich gebe jetzt an ab an Jan, der euch sagt, ihr könnt euch anmelden über Okay. Bis ihr die Folge hört, haben wir das bestimmt auf Meetup Punkt com eingestellt, achter Juni. Ich hab grad noch mal nachgeschaut, das sicherzustellen. Da findet das statt. Und ich glaube, ich hab jetzt nicht die Zeitzone im Kopf, aber es müsste 7 Uhr Nein, 7 Uhr. Wieder, genau. Ja. Und dann fangen wir vielleicht wie gewohnt bei uns bei dem Meet Up so 6 oder so was an. Da mach ich ein bisschen hier die Schöne auf und dann schauen wir mal, was es so Neues gibt und über welche AI Fehltritte wir dieses Jahr lästern können oder so was. Ich fand's sehr geil, dass es wirklich grade spontan entstanden ist. So diese Entscheidung, die grade spontan gefällt wurde, dann jetzt auch direkt von Jan. Sehr, ja, das ist mir Geil. Geil. Hat es doch tagelang darüber gefühlt geschrieben und jeder war so, ja, machen wir das jetzt oder machen wir das jetzt? Und dann hat er gesagt, okay, wir müssen uns Hat einfach heute entscheiden und dann Experiment. Ja, nee, nee, einfach so. Find ich gut. Das Ding ist, also wir sind nicht mal 'n Live Podcast, also wir können ja jetzt alles noch rausschneiden und so, aber wir machen das einfach so, als wär's live. Das ist krass. Ich glaub, wir haben wirklich noch nicht erschrocken. Ja. So verkacktes Intro könnte man noch mal neu machen. Aber nein. Wir haben nur den Intro. Sind wir nämlich. Die ungeschminkte Wahrheit gibt's nämlich bei der Programi war immer. Ja. Okay. AI News, die wir gemeinsam uns anschauen. Wie, Dennis, wie macht ihr das eigentlich nächste Woche, wenn ihr wenn wir alle nicht hier sind? Macht ihr dann trotzdem AI News? Schön, dass Du's live ansprichst. Ich weiß es ehrlich gesagt nicht. Also tatsächlich Lotum hat den Luxus, wir sind wieder auf unserem jährlichen Lotum Wochenende und sind 4 Tage in Portugal und Portugal? In die Veröffentlichungszeitraum und auch in den Aufnahmeseite der normalen AI News. Warte, meine Aufnahmen kriegt man wahrscheinlich hinter Dienstag. Dienstag kann man noch hinkriegen. Also Aufnahme ist eigentlich okay. Jetzt musst Du sagen gern, ob Du Bock hast auf das öffentlichem Video hochladen, wenn wir auch alles live hier. Es ist alles geil. Ich hab schon andere Podcasts vom Flughafen veröffentlicht, dass daran soll's nicht scheitern. Wir machen Okay. Also komm, lass uns das weitermachen, sonst wir haben doch total son totalen Streak seit ever. Jahren. Seit Jahren. Wunderbar. Eronen. War nix, ja. Gut. Nix mal auf. Jetzt aber ich würde ich weiß gar nicht genau, ob ich so ganz explizit gefragt habe, die Hörer*innen da draußen oder ob das einfach nur unser Gedankenspiel war. Wir überlegen ja, wie wir mit diesen beiden News Formaten weitermachen, weil wir hier auch immer viel über AI reden und ob's überhaupt noch Sinn macht, das Ganze zu trennen oder ob ihr das irgendwie zusammenbringen sollen. Also falls ihr da irgend einen Take zu habt, wollt ihr das gerne getrennt haben oder findet ihr's gut, wenn einfach die AI Themen, die jetzt nicht nur mehr Modelupdates sind, sondern vor allen Dingen Produkt und wie sind Prozesseoren, keine Ahnung, was solche Dinge, einfach auch in den normalen News besprochen werden. Und dann möchtet ihr es gerne als getrennte Formate haben, dann schreibt uns gerne an Podcast der Programmierpunkt bar. So ist es. Und weil wir, wie Dennis schon angefließt hat, auch in diesen Folgen immer nur über AI Themen sprechen, macht Dave direkt den Anfang und erzählt uns mal, was das bei Bun alles Neues gibt und was das mit AI zu tun hat. Ja. Ja und andererseits Bun ist ja unser unser Steckenwert. Unser Herzensthema seit vielen Jahren. Also genau gelungen ist das. Sebi ist jetzt das Thema. Ich wollt sagen, weiß ich nicht, das find ich so schön. Immer wenn's Band geht, muss jemand direkt an Sebi denken. Und das fühlt sich immer so an, als würd Sebi grad neben mir sitzen und mich streicheln. So, bisschen zu nah, die Lobmaschine hoch, aber jeden Fall, ich spür Sebi grade. Sebi spürt dich bestimmt auch grade. Genau, es geht Bun. Es geht gar nicht erst mal AI. Ja. Denn Jared Sumner, der Schöpfer von Bun, hat jetzt ein PR Gemerged. So weit, so unspannend erst mal, denkt man sich. Der Titel war aber schon sehr, sehr crazy. Titel war, also schon mal irgendwie schon krass. Wer's nicht wusste, vorher war's in Sig geschrieben. Einsatz, was Bun ist? Bun. Es ist für alles, was mit Java zu tun hat relevant. Also quasi man kennt ja Node und das ist einfach der komplette Tag von Node. Und wenn Du Java sagst, meinst Du, ja? Alter, das ist eher, ich bin wahrscheinlich immer nicht der Erste, dem was passiert ist, ja. Genau. Genau und genau, es war vorher in Sick geschrieben, kennt niemand und eigentlich Banden war so das größte Steckenpferd Ballerfinder, die das in Sick geschrieben haben. Sick. Sorry. Und es und es und das krasse ist aber jetzt, wenn man sich diese Dimension anschaut einfach von von von diesem PR, denn fast 2200 Filze wurden gechange und insgesamt 1000000 Zeilen Code wurden hinzugefügt. Es ist schon, also crazy natürlich, wenn man das hört, so ja okay, alles einfach rein und zack, merged. Jared selbst gibt da einige Vorteile an, hat gesagt, hey, ist runtergegangen 3 bis 8 Megabyte. Also da hat sich's schon mal 'n bisschen dafür gelohnt. Die haben zahlreiche Benchmarks auch gemacht, die neutral sind bis schneller so, was schon mal irgendwie ganz cool ist. Und größter Vorteil, den Sie genannt haben, ist, dass die jetzt für die Entwicklung von Banden so Tools haben, wodurch paar Memory Leaks behoben wurden direkt und in Zukunft halt natürlich diese verhindert werden, da das Deloping einfacher ist. Hat damals sehr, sehr viel Zeit gekostet und wird jetzt halt quasi deutlich schneller gehen einfach. Wer will, kann das Ganze auch schon ausprobieren mit Bun Upgrade minus minus Kanary. Kann man das Ganze jetzt schon mit mit Rust testen. Aber ist ja jetzt die Frage so, was ist doch da nicht so spannend? Ja. Also natürlich sieht man sich Dimension, 1000000 Signcall ist crazy so. Meine kleiner. Ist weißt ohne meine kleine Ecke, ist schon krass. Genau. Aber das Spannende daran ist und das ist natürlich grade für so ein AI Fanatiker, wie Dallas es ist, also krass, denn das das alles wurde mit AI neu geschrieben, komplett. Das also was ja schon mal an sich krass ist, ne, weil natürlich son von SIG zu Rust hätte wahrscheinlich vorher irgendwie mehrere Wochen, wenn nicht sogar Monate Zeit in Anspruch genommen, mehrere Entwickler, die da dran sind, das alles natürlich ausgiebig testen, was jetzt wahrscheinlich auch passiert ist, muss man sagen. Aber jetzt wurd es einfach in paar Tagen mit der RR runtergerattert. Also ich glaub, das war unter eine Woche und dann hat er es einfach reingemerged, aber und das ist jetzt, wo mich dann eure Meinung gleich auch noch mal interessieren wird, aber auch natürlich muss man sagen, in der gesamten Community war es ein sehr, sehr kontroverses Thema, wenn nicht sogar polarisierend. Also es war wirklich krass, wenn man so diesen PR gesehen hat so, also waren 1600 Daumen hoch, genauso viele Daumen runter. Es gab viele Herzen, auch viele lachende Smileys, viele traurige Smileys und so. Und wenn man jetzt irgendwie Twitter, Reddit, Hacker News et cetera sich irgendwie anschaut, das ist also schon sehr, sehr heiß diskutiert. Natürlich also zum einen, weil's komplett mit BI gemacht wurde, ne. Also das wird irgendwie so 'n ganzer so irgendwie, was schon irgendwie krass Aber natürlich auch sone Frage war, die aufgetaucht hat so, warum jetzt einmal der in Rust, ne? Das ist ja auch irgendwie sone berechtigte Frage. Man hat sich damals Physik entschieden, gab's wahrscheinlich auch Gründe für. Jetzt der ganze. Und tatsächlich haben sich da so 2 Lager gebildet, wo ich ehrlicherweise sagen muss, ich kann auch beide Seiten verstehen. Offiziell gibt es halt so 3 Gründe, warum das jetzt gemacht wurde. Das eine ist halt Ökosystem und. Sieg ist halt wahnsinnig jung. Ich glaub, die Sprache existiert vielleicht 10 Jahre, wenn nicht so weniger. Und eigentlich das gesamte Bunte musste alles neu schreiben. Also egal, was sie brauchten, so die mussten das halt in Sigg erst mal selbst schreiben. Und natürlich Rust gibt's schon seit Ewigkeiten, hat 'n superkrasses Ökosystem, konnten das megageil nutzen. Punkt 2 ist Sicherheit und Memoryleaks. So SIG ist halt son bisschen ein bisschen niceres c oder so. Was heißt niceres c, aber auf jeden Fall sehr zehnar. Das heißt, man muss sich halt Speicherallokation und so was halt selbst kümmern. Das übernimmt halt Russ selbst mit diesem. Wer's noch nicht kennt, kannst Du mal nachschauen. Ist da halt dafür da, dass er halt das automatisch alles prüft, so, dass da keine Memoryleaks entstehen. Und natürlich, Punkt 3, was ich auch nachvollziehen kann, das Entwicklerökosystem. Weil wenn die natürlich irgendwie Teamunterstützung brauchen und sagen so, hey, wir suchen richtig gute SIG Entwickler so, gibt's halt keine so. Rust Entwickler gibt's natürlich wie Sand am Meer gefühlt und dass das durchaus auch 'n Grund war, offizielle Seite vom Bann. Aber kurzer Factcheck, Factcheck, die Fake Programmiersprache Rust gibt es seit 2016, also seit 11 Jahren. Wirklich? Bist Du dir sicher? Rust oder Sik? Davor wurde es schon bei Monzilla 5 Jahre lang entwickelt. Ja, es ist Aber es ist jetzt ja noch nicht so, weil Du hast gesagt, es ist Ewigkeit und uralt und keiner Ja, aber der Dave ist 'n junger Kerl, von dem ich Für mich sind 2 Jahre die Hälfte meiner Lebens sein. Hab ich gesagt, den gibt's seit 10 Jahren. Ja, okay, das ist das ist jetzt nicht so großer Unterschied. Genau, aber die sind aber die sind ja keine großen Playerhändler, ne, muss man ja aussagen. Ja, richtig. So, richtig. Genau und also so viel das offizielle Statement. Es soll auch 'n Blogpost kommen tatsächlich von Jared, der hat gesagt, also erst mal nur 'n p r gemacht. Blogpost wird auf jeden Fall noch mal folgen, war bis Stand heute noch nicht da. Gegenseite hat natürlich gesagt so, na ja, irgendwie fühlt sich's an wie einfach nur 'n AI Showcase ehrlicherweise, ne. Also ich glaub, wir haben auch vor ungefähr 'nem halben Jahr, es müsste, glaub ich, so irgendwie Dezember gewesen sein, haben wir darüber berichtet, dass Anthropic Bun gekauft hat, ne, bei soner Acquisition. Ich glaub, Fabi hat damals drüber erzählt. Und natürlich kann man jetzt sagen, sone Anthropic will halt zeigen so, hey, guck mal, was Claude alles kann, ne. Hier Bun kennt ihr ja alle, superbeliebtes Produkt, supergroßes Open Source Produkt und hier allein mit Claude konnten wir jetzt alles einfach rüber machen zu Rust Und das ist einfach son Vorzeigeprojekt dafür, ne. Muss man auch ehrlicherweise sagen, da ist auch ein Stück Wahrheit dran, denn es ist natürlich, was immer heiß diskutiert wird, wie viel Ai Slop ist da drin? Und der Faktor ist durchaus vorhanden, muss man sagen, denn ich habe ja vorhin diesen angesprochen, der so Memory leaks verhindert, ne. Und das halt also der große Vorteil eigentlich an Rust. Und den kann man aber auch deaktivieren, indem man einfach schreibt und dann alles, was da ist, so sagst Du quasi dem dem Rust Compiler so, ja, ja, ich ich achte darauf, dass hier alles sicher ist. Und damit umgehst Du halt eigentlich das Ganze und es wurd halt einfach quasi 1 zu 1 von SEK übersetzt so. Also quasi Du hast halt kein idiomatisches Rust, sondern es ist halt wirklich einfach nur 'n 1 zu 1 Import, ohne wirklich die die Sprache zu berücksichtigen. Wurde aber auch an der Stelle von Jared schon gesagt so, hey, ja, ja, wissen wir, da kommen 'n paar Follow-upares, ne? Das wird wahrscheinlich auch alles mit der AI immer stückweise dann noch mal nachgeliefert, ne. Aber ist ist trotzdem so, dass das Stimmungsbild dadurch irgendwie trotzdem 'n bisschen negativ war, sag ich mal. Und jetzt vielleicht son bisschen so meine Meinung und auch danach gerne eure so. Also erstens, ich find das schon also wahnsinnig beeindruckend so, ne. Ich meine, also das ist schon krasser Scale, erst mal so 1000000 Zeilencodes so irgendwie noch mal, das komplett irgendwie umgeschrieben. Es also also es ist funktional, meine Relieaks wurden behoben so, es ist auch kleiner geworden so. Irgendwie ist es schon auf jeden Fall beeindruckend, ne, weil man sich so was vorher gar nicht vorstellen konnte. Vor allem grad, ne, in dieser Diskussion davon, man hätt sich wahrscheinlich länger überlegt so, ja, lohnt sich jetzt dieser Reeride? Machen wir das wirklich? Wie viele Entwickler brauchen wir? Wie lange dauert das? Was ist dann so der Outcom Ende? So und wahrscheinlich würd's man's eher nicht machen oder sehr stark depriorisieren oder man hätten noch mal oder müssen wir sagen, hey, das muss ich halt noch x Jahre rentieren, damit sich dieser Revit jetzt lohnt. Von daher ist jetzt irgendwie einfach krass, so diesen Schritt zu machen, na ja, wir machen's einfach. So, das find ich also schon irgendwie ganz cool. Und weil da ja auch irgendwie viele Leute so bisschen Sorgen hatten, na ja, das ist jetzt irgendwie alles fehleranfälliger und das wird dann irgendwie auch mal crashen und das ist nicht mehr so gut benutzbar wie davor. Ich hab tatsächlich also so zum einen irgendwie relativ viel Trust in der AI tatsächlich einfach so was umzuschreiben, so. Ich denk mir so irgendwie, das das kann das gut. Und zweitens hab ich auch irgendwie 'n starken Trust in einfach. Erstens, weil's halt sone sehr stark basierte Sprache ist. Und auch schon sehr lange. Und gibt's auch schon sehr lange. Ich mein, man kann ja auch gar nicht ohne schreiben, ja. Ja, eben, eben, das steckt hier sogar einfach drin. Krass. Alter, so, David's nicht schlecht. Ja, aber es war es war wirklich gut. 80 Prozent Trust ist. Genau, und dann jedenfalls diese starke Typisierung. Das heißt eigentlich, der der Compiler wird ja vorher fehlschlagen, wenn irgendwas auch schlecht halt umgeschrieben ist, so. Das heißt, Du kannst halt irgendwie nicht so fehlerhaften Coach schreiben wie beispielsweise bei JavaScript oder so was alles, ne, der dann halt erst so zu knallt. Von daher ist irgendwie so, dass also mein mein Glaube daran, dass das echt gut funktioniert hat, sehr hoch. Ist spannend, das auf jeden Fall auszuprobieren. Und irgendwie irgendwie auch cool, son bisschen diese Vorreiterstellung von Band zu sagen, ja, wisst ihr was? Komm, wir machen einfach und machen das und diese bisschen diese Vorreiterstellung so. Find ich geil so einfach so von der Attitude. Aber genau, auch außer spannend natürlich, was ihr dazu sagt. Mich, also mich wundert das gar nicht so sehr, dass dieser geklappt hat wie dich, glaub ich. Insbesondere, wenn man sich anschaut, dass, wie Du ja gesagt hast, sie einfach nur viel sick in Rust portiert haben und halt nicht rustspezifische Sachen irgendwie verwendet haben. Ich glaube, Mhm. Interessanter wäre gewesen, wenn sie wirklich sone Cleanroom Implementation gemacht hätten, gesagt hätten, hier ist die Testsuite von bun. So, das ist alles, was funktionieren muss. Und jetzt baust Du quasi so lange, bis Du halt all diese Tests irgendwie hinkriegst, ja, aber ohne die bestehende Code Base halt anzugucken. Einfach nur, auch halt fresh. Weil was dabei rauskommt, wär wahrscheinlich 'n viel nativeres Produkt gewesen. True. Und da hätte er dann wirklich mal schauen können, okay, wie viel Unterschied ergibt sich halt wirklich, ja? Jetzt ist, glaub ich, eher das Spannende, was im Nachgang damit passiert, ob diese ganzen Sick Artefakte, die jetzt in der Code Base drin sind, ob die halt noch aufgeräumt werden und wenn ja, ob das von Hand gemacht werden muss und ob das auch maschinell passiert und wie groß dann der Performancegain halt irgendwie ist, ja? Weil wenn sie jetzt, wie Du am Anfang gesagt hast, so paritär da irgendwie unterwegs sind, sich ungefähr gleich verhalten von Performance und so was, obwohl sie noch diese ganze im Prinzip mitportiert haben, ja, Mhm. Dann steht ja eigentlich zu hoffen, dass, wenn das mal ordentlich aufgeräumt ist, es dann wirklich noch besser werden kann. Ja. Aber ansonsten glaube ich, getestete Projekte zu portieren ist wahrscheinlich sogar einfacher, als wenn ich ihm jetzt die ungetestete programmierbarplattform hinwerfen würde und sagen würde, portier mir das mal zu oder Go oder keine Ahnung was. Ja. Wo dann vorne und hinten alles kaputtgeht. Das wär auch mein Take. Also ich glaube immer son son viel genutztes öffentliches Ding, Frameworkprojekt, was auch immer, was eine hohe Testabdeckung hat, da ist es natürlich wirklich 'n Einfacheres, das in in ähnlicher Qualität irgendwie irgendwie nachzubauen Und trotzdem natürlich beeindruckend, dass das geht in dem Skate und dass einfach dann irgendwo mehr oder weniger funktioniert und auch in diesem Zeitrahmen funktioniert. Und grundsätzlich ist es, glaub ich, am Ende würde ich jetzt, ohne jetzt in den Details drin zu sein, würd ich sagen, hörst Du dir erst mal nach 'ner vernünftigen Entscheidung an. Ich mein, wir werden uns immer weiter dahin entwickeln, dass viel mehr Teile von AI umgesetzt werden. Und wenn jetzt auch das eine Entscheidung ist, dass es halt viel mehr Trainingsdaten, Ressourcen et cetera in in Rust gibt, das Ganze zu machen und dass die Sprache, also womit das einfacher funktioniert. Ja, ja klar. Und man sicherer ist und so und und und so weiter, dann macht das Sinn. Und wenn Du halt einfach so wechseln kannst und jetzt ist die Hoffnung, dass da nicht massiv technische Schulden irgendwie aufgebaut wurden, aber dafür, wie gesagt, funktioniert es ja erst mal und ist nicht schlechter, beziehungsweise teilweise besser, Mhm. Dann kann man daran ja jetzt genauso mit AI rumoptimieren und die nächsten 100 generieren lassen. Mhm. Ich frag mich, wie sehr sich Microsoft grade son bisschen geärgert fühlt, weil die doch vor 'n paar Monaten diesen irgendwie angekündigt haben und das son ewig langes Projekt ist und sie so ultravorsichtig mit, wie machen wir diese Transition und bla bla bla so, ja. Und wenn jetzt ab wann einfach so die Ecke kommt, so, ja, ich hab da mal nachts irgendwie sonen Purry Quest aufgemacht Ist auch schon gemerkt. So, ja, ja, das macht schon alles. Ja, stimmt. Und jetzt ist Fedic, das ist natürlich auch son son krasses Kontrastprogramm, ja, wo man Ja. Ja eigentlich auch Microsoft unterstellen könnte, dass sie so die Power von Open AI irgendwie haben und das natürlich auch für 'n cooler cooler Move so sein könnte. Ja, aber hey, also ja. Und grade solche Use Cases braucht es ja auch, irgendwie zu demonstrieren, ne, was was irgendwie möglich ist. Ich finde, das ist ja auch immer noch 1, also und wenn es ne zu gehört, ist das halt mit Sicherheit Teil davon irgendwie zu zeigen, so was. Was sind die Möglichkeiten? Würde mich ja noch mal super interessieren so, was dann am Ende die Kosten auch waren beziehungsweise ne, also das ist ja dann vielleicht immer noch mal 'n anderes Setting, wenn Du so inhouse als Dropic Test machst, was was Ressourcengeschwindigkeit Komplett getroffen, ballert, Phasen, 1000 Sub Agents, keine Ahnung. Aber kommt vielleicht in den Blogposten noch 'n bisschen was. Ja, genau. Ich glaub, da wird das noch mal 'n bisschen elaborierter aufgedröselt, was alles war. Ja. Kein Take mehr. Ja, krass, nur durchaus positiv in der Runde. Komm, dafür jetzt kommt Jan. Ich wollt grad sagen, son bisschen. Tour noch sone Stimmung zu kippen hier. Genau. Warum ist Antropic scheiße, Jan? Na, also okay, vielleicht kurzer Disclaimer vorne ab so. Ich hasse nicht allgemein AI, auch wenn Dennis mir das immer so unterstellt. Ich benutze AI gerne, vielleicht 'n bisschen kritischer als manch andere oder so. Ja, aber ich hab trotzdem irgendwie Spaß damit. Aber und ich glaub, diese Diskussion hat angefangen in unserer letzten AI Week, ne. Da hatten wir son paar Diskussionen hier geführt, mal 'n bisschen länger und haben uns son bisschen angefangen, damit zu beschäftigen, so okay, was für was fürn moralischen Anspruch muss man eigentlich an son legitime Frage ist aus 2 Gründen. Also ne, warum stellt man sich nicht dieselben Fragen bei jedem Datenbankanbieter oder Hoster oder so was, den man verwendet, ja? Also warum werden die Leute bei AI irgendwie viel kritischer? Ich glaub zum einen, weil natürlich alle irgendwie bemüht sind, diesen Systemen irgendwie maximal viel Autonomie und und Spielraum und am Ende halt auch irgendwie Geld rüberzuschieben so, ja. Und mit mehr Anforderung kommt halt auch irgendwie mehr Erwartungshaltung. Und wenn sich natürlich alle diese Anbieter irgendwie auf die Fahne schreiben, dass sie hier irgendwie AGI erreichen wollen und superautonome menschliche Agenten bauen und bla bla bla, da ist natürlich so ihr Verhalten auch son bisschen Rückspiegelung auf, na ja, wie verhalten sich halt dieses oder was kann man von diesem System am Ende des Tages erwarten, ja? Und deshalb gibt's da, glaub ich, generell eine eine andere Erwartungshaltung. So. Mit dem, ja. Ich hab, glaub ich, sone sehr Achterbahnartige Reise da irgendwie hinter mir und mich würde mal so euer Take dazu interessieren, weil gefühlt sind es ja immer so Zyklen von 1 von diesen Anbietern macht irgendwie was mega Cooles und alle springen drauf und dann werden wir irgendwie enttäuscht. So. Also Open AI war superlange irgendwie das das Lieblingskind von allen, ja, insbesondere ganz, ganz, ganz am Anfang, als sie noch mit so offenen GPT Modellen gearbeitet hat. Man konnte die Paper dazu lesen, man konnte das selber ausprobieren. Sie hatten irgendwie so diesen Ansatz von, wir sind hier dieses Non profit Lab, was irgendwie nur Gutes erreichen will und sammeln dafür Venturekapital ein, aber verballern das eigentlich, hier so die Menschheit voranzubringen und alle so yeah und das klappt schon. Sie hatten irgendwie eigene Teams dafür, die sich damit beschäftigt haben. Na ja, Kurze Frage war das war das noch zu GPT-zwei-Zeiten oder wann war das? Ja, das war so GPT generell und GPT-zwei und so, so wirklich ganz früh. Wir sind hier so Ja, wir sind 20, 18, 19. Ja, krass. Ne, also sehr gut. Also jetzt hab ich auch was Neues gelernt, das muss ich gar nicht. Was war das? TypT 2? Ja, da war ich noch bei Shopify Lass es mal 21 oder 22 gewesen sein. Okay. Nicht früher, JPC 2 und 3, ne? Mhm. Okay, so weiter im Text. Auf alle Fälle und bla bla bla. Und dann haben sie halt irgendwie so angefangen, sobald sie gesehen haben, oh, man kann aus ChatGPT irgendwie 'n cooles Produkt machen und lass doch mal diesen Non Profit Ansatz über Bord schmeißen und damit irgendwie ordentlich Geld verdienen und lass doch auch mal dieses Safety und Alignment Team irgendwie rausschmeißen. Die halten uns nur alle irgendwie zurück. Und dann diese ganze Geschichte, wie sie Sam Ortman gefeuert haben und wieder reingeholt haben und dann das halbe Board rausgeschmissen und so. Also es hat halt irgendwie alles son sehr faden Beigeschmack von dieser dieser moralische Kompass, den man irgendwie am Anfang zugetraut hat. Der ist halt irgendwie verloren gegangen so in in the process, so. Dann kommt irgendwie auf die Bühne. Ich glaub, 20 21, 22 haben die auch damit angefangen, mit Leuten, von Leuten gegründet, die bei OpenAI rausgegangen sind, weil sie halt genau das bemängelt haben, ne, gesagt haben, oh, zu viel Kommerz, zu wenig Sicherheit. Wir wir machen das anders. Wir machen hier 'n Safety First AI Laden auf und wir haben irgendwie Grundsätze und wollen das durchziehen und und bla. Und das war irgendwie da alles wieder cool und alle hatten irgendwie ihr neues Lieblings AI Kind gefunden und sind da irgendwie drauf gesprungen. Und dann, na ja, also es war von Anfang an vielleicht son bisschen schwierig mit denen, wenn man da guckt, wer da auch vielleicht als Investor dringesessen hat und wie das alles so funktioniert hat, aber auf alle Fälle Wer denn zum Beispiel? Der gehört ja, weißt Du? Also, ne, man ist jetzt eine andere Diskussion, wie weit will man quasi ein Unternehmen dafür verantwortlich machen, wer da als Investor drinsitzt und wie die sich verhalten, ja. Aber wenn man sich anguckt, dass da irgendwie so Sam Bankman Fried, der ja mit FTX diesen großen Krypto Scam quasi an die Wand gefahren hat, der hat da irgendwie, glaub ich, am Anfang 'n paar 100000000 Dollar reingesteckt, das aufzubauen, so schwierig. Mhm. Anyway, Intropic geht irgendwie durch die Decke, alles megacool, bis sie jetzt anfangen. Komische Sachen mit Pricing und SDK Restriktions und wer darf überhaupt unsere API nutzen und für was und überhaupt. Da kann man doch sagen, na ja, ne, ist halt 'n Business. Die dürfen selber entscheiden, wem sie ihr Produkt verkaufen. Haben sie ja im im Pentagon Fall auch irgendwie gemacht und da waren wir alle irgendwie auf ihrer Seite zu sagen, so hey, verkauft das mal nicht irgendwie an die Rüstungsindustrie, das ist alles cool. Mhm. Und dann kamen da so Deals wie, ja, ja, zahlt jetzt jeden Monat irgendwie anderthalb Milliarden Dollar oder so was an xA I, ihre Datencenter zu mieten. Das vielleicht auch irgendwie uncool und man will nicht das Geld irgendwie dahin geht, weil Ex und Grok und Musk irgendwie son ganz komischer eigener Sumpf sind. Und den finanziert man jetzt quasi sehr direkt mit, wenn man irgendwie 'n nutzt, weil sie halt auf die Hardware und die Rechenzentren von denen angewiesen sind. Schwierig, schwierig, schwierig. Dann gab's irgendwie noch Mysteral aus Europa und alle so, weniger Abhängigkeit irgendwie nach nach USA und die haben sich auf die Fahne geschrieben, dass irgendwie auch so Open Source AI zu bauen und irgendwie Independence halt für diesen ganzen US Tech Konzernen aufzubauen und haben dann auch son bisschen gelobyt gegen den oder an dem EU AI Act rumzuschrauben, dass es halt nicht zu strengen wird und dass wir ja auch eigene Sachen aufbauen können und son bisschen mit diesen Frontier Labs aus Nordamerika konkurrieren können und bla. Bis sie dann, nachdem das halt irgendwie alles durch waren, gesagt haben, na ja, wir machen jetzt halt sonen exklusiven Deal mit Microsoft. Das mit diesem ganzen Open Source EU Zeug, das müssen wir eigentlich alles gar nicht so wichtig nehmen Und wir vertreiben jetzt unser Zeug exklusiv eben über Microsoft, die investieren, die kriegen hier 'n Anteil bei uns und das war irgendwie dahin mit der schönen EU Souveränität. Und das, also ich weiß nicht, man kann hier noch, man können bestimmt auch über Google reden. Ich weiß nicht, ob wir über Meta und Excel noch getrennt reden müssen, aber die Story ist halt gefühlt immer dasselbe. Es kommt 'n cooles Produkt raus, ja. Lama haben auch irgendwie alle abgefeiert am Anfang, als es frisch und neu war. Und dann irgendwie kippt diese ganze Geschichte wieder. Und gefühlt sitze ich immer da, wenn ich diese Produkte benutze und freu mich, wie cool sie funktionieren und fühl mich gleichzeitig so schlecht dabei, wo sie irgendwie so herkommen, ja? Und da würde mich mal mal euer Take interessieren. Oh, ich find einfach so, das das größte Thema ist ja einfach hier, also Wirtschaftlichkeit, oder? Also ich glaub, das ist halt so einfach so der größte Knackpunkt und also ne, man man man man kann mit 'ner gewissen Moralvorstellung ja auch irgendwie in die Sache reingehen und und für etwas stehen, Aber man weiß ja auch, wie wie wie teuer einfach dieser gesamte AI Kram ist so, ne. Sei es halt in der Forschung, sei es das dann auch zu betreiben und so was alles. Und ich kann mir das schon durchaus, was jemand sagt, na ja, es muss halt irgendwie wirtschaftlich sein am Ende oder wir gehen halt irgendwie pleite und zum Teil musst Du dann son bisschen vielleicht dein deine Werte verkaufen und sagen, hey, okay, ja gut, dann ist jetzt irgendwie Microsoft da, die uns da voll viel Geld für geben. Das finanziert uns auf jeden Fall und wir können weiter irgendwie coole Dinge machen. Die andere Option wäre, na ja, es ist nicht wirtschaftlich, es es passt halt irgendwie nicht weiter. Und ich glaub, das ist halt son bisschen leider irgendwie sone notgedrungene Sache dann immer an der Stelle, halt weil's halt eben so teuer ist. Ich glaub, das ist so durchaus der größte Faktor. Und ich glaub und dann kann man natürlich dann entscheiden so, wie also wie betrachten man das Ganze moralisch so. Das wär natürlich die nächste Frage. Tja. Kann man wahrscheinlich, ja, kann man wahrscheinlich wieder sehr, also entweder mit 'nem sehr pessimistischen oder optimistischen Blick irgendwie drauf gucken, weil Du hast am Anfang ja auch selbst den Vergleich gezogen, ja, zu den ganzen anderen Dingen, die wir irgendwie nutzen und wo wir uns vielleicht nicht so viele Gedanken machen. Und vielleicht ist da das da irgendwo vergleichbar. Also ne, ist jetzt die Google Cloud oder die ABS Cloud oder ne, was also oder auch einfach jegliches jegliche Dienst, den man hat mit Linear, mit wo zahlen wir noch viel? Miro, Slack. Atlas. Atlas, Ne, keine Ahnung was. Das sind ja überall alles so Fragen, jetzt speziell bei uns. Wir sind ziemlich groß auf der auf Facebook, Instant Games so als Partner mit mit Matter. Finde ich schwierig und ja klar ist es dann auch noch mal, aber ich glaub, das ist dann irgendwie auch dann am Ende irgendwie die Realität, die dann auf die Unternehmen so niederprasselt, ne, wenn Du irgendwie da startest und sagst, hey, wir sind die Guten und wir machen das jetzt so moralisch alles richtig und haben irgendwo auch diese Ansprüche, das zerschellt dann vielleicht einfach son bisschen an der harten Realität, weil Mhm. Wenn Du's dann nicht veröffentlichst beispielsweise, ne, irgendwie jetzt einen Modell und sagst, ja, nee, da müssen wir noch 'n bisschen gucken und Training, keine Ahnung was, dann macht's halt 'n anderer und verdient halt dann vor dir das Geld damit und Du bist vielleicht abgeschnitten. Und natürlich ist das irgendwo gesellschaftlich kacke, dass es so ist, aber ich mein, das ist halt irgendwie der Kapitalismus, in dem wir leben und wo es halt darum geht, möglichst erfolgreich am Markt zu sein. Wenn die sich jetzt alle zusammenschließen würden und sagen würden, ja, lass uns das mal irgendwie, ne, vernünftig gemeinsam machen, dann hätten wir als Menschheit wahrscheinlich mehr davon, aber so hat's halt noch nie funktioniert. Und auf der einen Seite treibt es natürlich auch die Innovation voran, ne, dass es möglichst schnell irgendwie sich weiterentwickeln muss und man da deswegen auch, also dass der Mit der Grund ist, dass wir halt diese rasante Weiterentwicklung haben, weil all die Milliarden irgendwie da reingegossen werden. Und wahrscheinlich musst Du dann irgendwie so selbst sein den den das kleinste Übel für dich selbst irgendwie rausfinden. Und ich mein, es gibt halt auch noch die Extreme, ne. Ich würd's auch noch nie hier so diskutiert, also deshalb irgendwie ja, bei bei Musk, von dem ich vor, man, Kameras draus, 16 Jahren, ne, irgendwie 'n großer, was heißt 'n großer Fan war, weil ich fand das schon irgendwo über sehr lange Zeit sehr beeindruckend. Ich hab das sehr nah verfolgt, alles, was er so gemacht hat und hab mir gedacht, okay, Wahnsinn, ne. Wie wie kann 1 das so irgendwie parallel, ist man unabhängig, wie viele davon wirklich irgendwie selbst gemacht hat, aber es drehte sich halt einfach sehr viel seine Person und er hat sehr, sehr viel bewegt und und war da total begeistert vor und dann dann fragst Du dich, wie kann jemand, ne, so irgendwie, weiß ich nicht, abrutschen oder in in ins Falsche, ja, abdrehen und dann in hinten die falschen Kontakte irgendwie kommen. Und irgendwie ist es ja auch natürlich, ich mein, ich mein, wenn Du dir Wie sollst Du wie sollst Du normal bleiben, wenn Du der reichste Mensch der Welt bist, so? Also da da brauchst Du irgendwie besondere besondere Grundlagen irgendwie, dass dass das passiert. Und Du kannst ja wirklich Sachen machen. Ich mein, Du Du bist dann je näher, die die, ne, die die erste, keine Ahnung, das erste Mal eine Rakete wieder aufgefangen hat. Also Du bist natürlich das nicht, aber halt irgendwie die Unternehmen, für die Du dich verantwortlich zeichnest. Und dass Du da irgendwann dann halt, ja, bisschen gaga wirst, das kann ich schon irgendwie auch nachvollziehen. Ich würd dir Und so ähnlich ist es wahrscheinlich auch. Auslux mit Elon Musk war einfach so, oh, ich hab den ja nicht schon da eigentlich gemacht. Eigentlich mehr so zu Dennis' persönlicher Reise gegangen. Ach wisst ihr auch, Blau ist by the way meine Lieblingsfarbe. Schon. Genau, aber jetzt aber den Übergang. Genug Kontext zu Elon Musk und dann und so ähnlich ist es auch Ja, genau, also und da ist es irgendwie dann so der für uns jetzt hier in, ja, ist für viele, glaube ich, in Deutschland und so ist es da irgendwie sone harte oder eine klare Grenze, wo man irgendwann gesagt hat, okay, das geht uns dann zu weit mit, ne, Trump Support und im und in der Regierung sitzen und so was. Und da meine ich nur, da muss wahrscheinlich jeder für sich irgendwo halt diese Grenzen irgendwie ausloten und sagen, okay, ab wann ist es was, wo es mich stört. Ab wann ist es halt irgendwie unterliegen und mit dem wir uns irgendwie zurechtfinden müssen. Das muss man ja auf Unternehmensweise auch. Ich mein, kann man jetzt Clayd oder OpenAI boykottieren einfach nur aus diesen Gründen oder ist der Schaden dann für die eigene Firma auch wieder so groß, weil man halt nicht das das Beste und die die die größten Modelle nutzt so? Ich musste mich, ich ich war hart an den Batman Film erinnert. Jetzt weiß leider nicht, in welchem von der Trilogie das war. Ich glaub eine Dark Knight Rights. Wenn er sagt, so. So gefühlt verhalten sich ja diese ganzen Airi Labs. So die starten alle superoptimistisch und irgendwann, wie Du schon sagst, ne, treffen sich halt auch sone sone harte Realität, mit der sie halt irgendwie Mhm. Umgehen müssen. Was ja vielleicht aber auch gar nicht so schlimm wäre, wenn sie sich das vorher gar nicht so stark auf die Banner geschrieben hätten, ja. Also dadurch entsteht ja dieser Kontrast. Und ich glaube, das macht auch sone Unterschied aus zu dem, was Du grade selber sagtest, dann hör mal zu zu Facebook, zu Google Cloud Hosting zu, keine Ahnung, ne. Google Cloud Hosting ist nie gestartet mit, wir sind hier, weil wir 'n moralischen Kompass haben und die Welt besser machen wollen, so, ja. Und und scheitern dann daran, sondern die sind halt 'n relativ transparentes Unternehmen, so. Natürlich hat Google irgendwann mal so ganz, ganz früher mit Do No Evil und so was angefangen, aber das ist ja schon, also das das glaubt, glaube ich, keiner mehr. Ja, genau. Aber ja, richtig, richtig, aber das, ey, ich mein, da kannst Du doch die gleiche Geschichte auch erzählen. Ich mein, irgendwo haben sie das doch genauso gesagt und wollten die Welt seine Besserung und Apple doch auch. Ich mein, die sehen sich doch schon auch als Weltverbesserer. Aber na ja und und die die haben halt immerhin ehrlicherweise dann mit diesem AI Shit aufgehört, ne. So, die haben gesagt, so so wie wir das haben wollen würden, unseren Ansprüchen gerecht zu werden, so kriegen wir das nicht gebaut. Ja, Ja. Schalten wir nicht. Ist ja so. Mhm. Ja, wir wir können kein Siri bauen, was Privatsphäre so respektiert, was was nicht halluziniert, unseren Ansprüchen gerecht zu werden, dann lassen wir's lieber. Das ist ja auch irgendwie eine Alternative, ja. Und das meine ich halt so, diese diese diese Diskrepanz zwischen Anspruch und Möglichkeit, das ist, glaube ich, das, was für mich so frustrierend ist und gar nicht dieses kapitalistisch. Also ich mein, da muss man sich ja überhaupt keine Illusion hingeben, Mhm. Dass hier nicht jeder Player auch Teil dieses Systems ist, so. Ja. Aber halt auch bei Apple ist es natürlich eine Lücke mit irgendwie Privacy und Datenschutz und so was, die sie natürlich marketingtechnisch irgendwann, ne, wo sie gemerkt haben, also da waren sie halt sehr, sehr schlau, sehr früh, aber dass das 'n Ding wird und haben halt dadurch aber mit Sicherheit auch aus Business Perspektive so, ne, dass das was ist, womit man Geld machen kann, auf Privatsphäre zu setzen. Aber was mich jetzt an der Stelle interessieren würde, ich sag's dir, Jan oder Dennis, wie war das eigentlich bei Elon Musk, Eigentlich Elon Musks Privatsphäre. Das ist doch Genau, genau. Und zwar aber, also weil Du's grade so gesagt hast, so von wegen, ja, Google schreibt sich das nicht auf die Fahne, aber propagieren oder haben das diese AI Unternehmen davor so krass propagiert? Son Entropic oder auch son Mystereier, dass die gesagt haben, ja, ja, wir sind die Weltwörter, sondern wir machen das auf eine gute Art und Weise. Also ich hatte eher das Gefühl, die wurden halt einfach so Drive by sympathisch, ne. Also irgendwie so, ja, wir, ne, Entropic, die gesagt haben, wir wollen nicht, dass das für militärische Zwecke benutzt wird. Also das haben die aus freien Städte, ja irgendwie so bisschen gesagt. Haben die sich wirklich so positioniert? Also das ist ja die Frage, ja. Ja, okay. Dann Nein. Ich hasse nicht übernehmen, nein. Okay, genug Aber ich fand der E-Roll. Nein, wirklich Wann nehmen wir das Elon Musk Special auf. Ich weiß nicht mehr genau, wie diese Zeiten waren, aber so ich hab wirklich, fast alle Präsentationen so was geguckt, weil ich das einfach, ich fand, der hat die Welt so irgendwie, ich fand, der hat die Welt schön erklärt, so als es diese ersten Solasachen gab und so was. Und sonst hörte sich so alles sinnvoll und hey, wir können das machen und das ist alles, dann fixen wir das und alles gut und so. Es war Ist ist die erste Frage ist doch Dennis, warum hast Du nie 'n Tesla gehabt? Bis jetzt. Nee, weil sie, ja, jetzt schließe ich's ja aus, aber weil sie mir zu lange noch zu teuer waren und ich nicht so viel Geld für 'n Auto ausgeben wollte. Also ich konnte es mir in dem Sinne noch nicht leisten und dann war der Moment, vorbei auf die Eltern, die ich mir gegangen bist, wo ich's hätte machen können. Ja. Aber ja, ist krass. Also ich mein, ja, ich hab es jahrelang gefeiert und da geht das Update verfolgt so, was das angeht. Ja. Aber ich bin nicht gefragt, ist der Musk überhaupt 'n guter Speaker? Weißt Du jetzt, guck ich mir die chinesischen Euros an. Ja, also der der fühlt es richtig und der kann das mit Überzeugung rüberbringen und sag, hey, guck mal, das ist das geilste Ding, was ich in der Handhaber so der Welt so. Es gibt nichts Krasseres als dieses iPhone hier so. Das fand ich schon bei Steve Jobs irgendwie ganz cool so. Das kam auch sehr authentisch drüber. Bei Musk, ich hab nur so, glaub ich, eine Präsentation, die macht mir so, ja, es ist okay. So, ich weiß nicht, er hat mir irgendwie als als Er war kein, nein, der war kein ja, ja und nein. Also er war kein guter Speaker. Er ist kein guter Speaker, aber er ist 'n guter Nerd. Ja und aber Du hast ihn dadurch das noch mal so mehr abgekauft, dass er halt darüber so nachgedacht hat und gesagt hat, ja, machen wir das so. Er war so auch in diesen Präsentationen. Du warst halt irgendwie, das hörte sich sehr sinnvoll und sehr bar an, so, was er gesagt hat. Natürlich war er nicht so shiny und vorbereitet, ne. Es war ihm alles verspätet, das war und so weiter. Es war also, was die Präsentationsthemen angeht, ja. Vielleicht zu dem, was Apple gemacht hat. Ja. Aber trotzdem einfach von den Ideen so, dass Du dachtest so, das ist, so geht das sehr easy. Klar, schließen wir unsere Kabel im Kopf an und fahren dann autonom besser. Also. Schön. Okay. Die Folge noch mal 'n bisschen positiv zu drehen, lassen wir dir bitte. Dir bitte. Was zu den Designer Walls erzählen. Alter. Das auch noch. Haben wir nicht gesagt? Das Thema was? Hast Du gesagt? Das ist eine kurze Folge. Was steht auf dem Regal? Echt, nein. Ach, 'n neues Ach, mal. Deswegen ist ja immer gesagt, es wird die kürzeste Folge ever. Mhm. Dave hat's halt gegen weich falsch. Das sollte man halt einfach vor der Aufnahme nicht sagen. Ja. Na ja, deswegen weiß ich nicht mehr, ich bin einzige, der also 'n Thema vorbereitet hat so und ihr nicht zu sehen, dass ich mir Ich war vorbereitet. Hallo? Hallo. Ja, aber das ist ja son Gedankenspiel. Ja, doch. Das ist schon okay. Ja. Dennis. Was ist das denn überhaupt? Ja, ja. Was sind die? Jedes Jahr zur WWDC verkündet Apple so, es gibt aus verschiedenen Kategorien Apps, die wir vorher nominiert haben und dann gibt es die Gewinner und da geht's eben darum, es geht unterschiedliche Kategorien und dort nutzen dann diese Apps im in der Regel halt irgendwo die technischen Innovationen des Apple Ökosystems bestmöglich aus. Das ist halt natürlich auch son bisschen auf die eigene Schulter klopfen. Guck mal, was wir alles können. Guck mal, was die Entwickler*innen da draußen alles mit unseren tollen Frameworks machen können und das schaukesen wir dann Mhm. Und zeigen das. Und es gibt dieses Jahr 6 verschiedene Kategorien, die anfangen bei Delight and Fun. Das sind wir. Wir sind Delight and Fun. Und also, ne, sie sagen so was wie, bei Apple Technologies, ne. Also Du willst, wenn Du da gewinnen willst, musst Du schon so den maximalen Apple Weg, am besten keine Android App. Von Apple Watch bis alles, keine Ahnung was. Was weißt Du, das neueste, größte, letzte? Früher wusste ich das alles, ja. Was denn? Was Größte? Irgendwas Cooles, was nur Apple irgendwie, wo sie sagen, wahrscheinlich hier so diesen Kamerabutton oder so wie es so. Alles. Ach so, Kamerabutton. Na ja, ich hatte jetzt grad so Vision OS ist auch immer noch son Thema Genau, ja, ja, genau, da wär ich da irgendwo reinkommen, aber so was wie das halt den Hardware Button da an der Seite jetzt ordentlich nutzt und da eine coole Experience aus diesem, weil es halt nur Ah, weil Du weil Du weil es ja auch so sensitiv ist und damit könntest Du ja auch 'n spielerisches Element machen, indem Du halt die Kamera unterdrück drückst und Ja, ja, okay. So. Und dann gibt es immer jetzt halt dann iOS, Vision OS und Mac OS. Ich weiß nicht, ob das immer so ist in iPad. Und wahrscheinlich auch Watch OS, iPad OS, TV OS. Genau. Die ganzen Sachen, oder? Ja, ja. So. Und wenn es dann natürlich auf unterschiedlichen Plattformen geht, ist das natürlich auch noch mal cool. Grundsätzlich kann man schon sagen, da sind Apps, die sich halt also ne, die sich cool anfühlen. Von daher, die mal an zu ist immer son ganz guter, da will man mal coole Apps sehen, was so State of the Art, was App Design angeht. Nee oder was. Also kann man da mal rein. Nee, mal State of the Art, sondern ich hab 'n paar Reihen gesprochen. Ich find, die sind manchmal so einfach so einfach so einfach so cool, so irgendwie so, oh, das hatte ich bisher noch nicht erlebt in soner App. Ja. Und das war irgendwie cool, so einfach so, was was kann man denn theoretisch machen? Und ich also ich find schon sehr interessant. Da mal eine Lanze für Lotum und die Programmierbar zu brechen. 1 der Nominierten ist Ist die Programmier App. Nein. Ist aber ein, den Sven hier schon mal vorgestellt hat, als er zu Gast war und wir über Game Development und die Devcom und die Gamescom und so was alles gesprochen haben, da war das sein Pick. Und er hat schon irgendwie damals 'n coolen Pitch für das Spiel gemacht und offensichtlich hat Apple ihm zugehört und ihm deshalb Hat das gehört. Ja. Natürlich. Wen ich wen ich wen hab ich gehört? Wen war's denn? Nein. Wunderbares Spiel übrigens. Hab ich mir auf Spenens Empfehlung auch damals direkt gekauft und gut investiertes Geld. Krass. Ja. Weil Du sagst, gekauft hast, ist dann auch sone Paid App, ne? Das ist halt auch so was. 9 Euro 99. Genau, halt nicht son nicht son jedes Gleiche wieder werbebasierte Ding und keine Ahnung Casual game, sondern son bisschen auf Also unsere Spiele kommen da nicht rein, wolltest Du jetzt sagen. Ja. Das ist richtig. Also ich bin ziemlich sicher, dass wir uns nicht besonders qualifizieren für die Apple Designer. Noch nicht. Growth Mindset, noch nicht. Also, pass auf. Wir machen spontan ein Gewinnspiel da draus. Wir haben die Kategorien. Mhm. Und da ist dann jeweils noch mal unterschieden nach Apps und Games in jeweils diesen Kategorien. Das heißt, am Ende wird es summar summarum 12 unterschiedliche Apps geben. Die gewinnen. Die gewinnen. Mhm. Ich korrigier jetzt grad noch mal das, was ich grade ankünd. Das ist ja schon ganz schön viel, 12 Apps. Ich wollte eigentlich sagen Ja, okay. Also wir machen da jetzt 'n Gewinnspiel. Kein Gewinnspiel. Doch, wir machen 'n Gewinnspiel raus. Jeder, der 10 von 12 der Finalisten vor der w w vor der vor der Veröffentlichung der Finalisten, nicht der Finalisten, der Sieger. Sieger. Der Gewinner uns schreibt an Programmier, an wo? An Gewinnspiel. Nein, an Podcast at Programmier Punkt Bar oder über eine Kontaktformular auf der Webseite und schreibt, wenn es funktioniert. Dann ist der oder diejenige in einem Lospott, ich kann nicht mehr reden, Lospott. Pott? Nein, Pott ist okay. Ich wir sind bei uns Podcast, deswegen. Und Jan, was kann man gewinnen am Ende? Ich war grade zu sehr abgelenkt mit, ich muss doch diese Gewinnspiel AGBs auf die Webseite bringen, die Du grade angekündigt hast, weil sonst heißen wir Richard den Kopf ab, wenn wir was verlosen, ohne dass irgendwie unseren hier zu covern vorher. Okay, komm. Ich glaub, das ist aber eine Liveshow. Es ist eine Liveshow. Also ich will, es kann dir sowas kann passieren. So was kann machen, 'n richtig dicken Gewinn raus und zwar ein Programmierconticket. What? Das ist alles krass. Inklusive Medien Greets. Programmierkonticket und Du musst was nur, damit ich's richtig verstanden hab und noch mal zusammenfasste. Du musst aus den 12 Kategorien, die's quasi gibt, 10 Richtige benennen, die dann am Ende auch quasi gewinnen. Ja. Weil das Und was, wenn's den Gleichstand gibt? Was, wenn's, das ist ja deswegen Los Pot. Ach ja, okay, Los Okay, Du musst 10 von 12 richtig haben und dann kommst Du Los Pot. Ja. Und wenn's nur 1 macht, dann entweder kriegt er's oder kriegt nichts. Ja. Okay, weil ist dann fifty fifty, okay. Genau. Und was ist die Programmiercon? Das ist unsere Konferenz, die dieses Jahr stattfindet am November, fünfundzwanzigsten, sechsundzwanzigsten November. Zweitägig. Zweitägig mit 2 Tracks und der reguläre Ticketpreis wird am Ende bei dreihundertundneun und für 90. 49, was was sagt Jan? Jan, ich kann nicht Lippen lesen. Noch nicht. Noch nicht. Noch nicht. Dreineunundneunzig. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49. Ja. Finalpreis am Ende wird bei 349 Euro liegen. Das heißt, da ist was drin. Das ist voll das Krasse. Das ist voll das Krasse. Ja, ja. So, dann macht Jan kurz die AGW fertig. Das muss jetzt morgen fertig sein, Jan. Ja, ich weiß, was heut noch alles macht. Sonst muss ich alles innerhalb der letzten halben Stunde ergeben, das find ich schön. Ja, ich muss das hier WWWWWWWWWWWWWW Punkt com, wir machen hier das AGB, wünschen wir alles easy, das dafür sind wir ja da. Ja. Aber aber Dennis, hast Du denn irgendwelche Favorites aus dieser Liste oder? Können wir noch was daraus machen, dass wenn der Gewinner dann zum gemeinsamen Gucken der WWDC herkommt, dann kriegt er noch eine Chipstide obendrauf. Oh. Und sein Ticket persönlich, können wir das dann auch so Das taucht wir auch. Dennis springt aus 'ner Torte raus. Ausm Plotter drücken und kriegt son großes Ticket dann in die Hand gedrückt. Ja. Es muss überdimensional sein. Was ist was ist was ist groß größer als a 1? 0. A 0? Ja. Was ist größer als a 0? A minus 1? Gibt's es auch? Nein. Okay, das ist a 0 mal 4. So groß muss das sein. Dave ist 'n Developer, der nicht bis 0 zählt kann. Und was war das nämlich? Ein Zeitungsbogen. Früher. Ein Zeitungsbogen? Ja, ist a 0? Mhm. Krass. Wieder was gelernt in der Programmier war zum Schluss doch noch gefährliches Wissen. Ah ja. Wir lassen gut, mal zu verstehen. Ja, also 'n gutes Partywissen. Kann man auch mal raushauen, bis es jemand checkt und dann hieß er, ja, stimmt gar nicht. Und man Ich hab mal in 'nem Antiariat gearbeitet, gejobbt. Und das hat auch schon irgendwas mit Elon Musk zu tun. Aber das das sehen wir für eine andere Folge auch. Für unser Special mit Elon Musk. Ja. So. Wir verabschieden uns für heute. Ach so, okay, es gibt gar keine Nominierung von euch oder so oder was, was ihr Nein. Herausragen könnt. Ach okay, krass. Okay. Wir lassen ja jetzt Community. Cool. Ja, richtig. Cool, wenn es 'n Vorteile geben oder so. Ja. Was kriege ich, wenn ich 10 von 12 ruhig hab? 'N Kurs von denen Darfst Du auch auf die Programmierkunden kommen? Okay. Mit mit mir. Mit Dave, ja. Sehr gut, wir sperren uns in dein Kämmerchen. Alright. Gut, aber Bis zum Ende 3 Woche. 2. 1. 1. Und tschüs. 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0: Hallo und herzlich willkommen zu den Programmierball News heute in Kalenderwoche 22. Hab ich natürlich gewusst und bin vollkommen vorbereitet. Ich bin der, ich muss das jetzt hier wieder richtig sagen, Jan Gregor Engetriebel wurde mir gesagt und mit mir im Studio sitzen,\n\nSpeaker 1: Dennis Becker. Oh, das ist für\n\nSpeaker 2: einfach ganz toll. Komplett backert, Alter.\n\nSpeaker 0: Aber ich dachte,\n\nSpeaker 1: d ist voll weit vorne.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, aber d, genau d ist voll weit vorne, aber d a ist näher als d e. Ja, das ist\n\nSpeaker 3: nicht, dass\n\nSpeaker 2: ich der Obst war\n\nSpeaker 1: und nicht vorher vorher.\n\nSpeaker 2: Stimmt, das ist crazy. Also warte mal, wer ist sie, Dennis Becker? Dennis Becker. Und auch noch Dave Acker, Dave Krusitzky Acker, der sommerliche Boy.\n\nSpeaker 0: Yes. Mal kurz festhalten, dass wenn ich einmal richtiges Intro mach, ihr es verkackt habt, so,\n\nSpeaker 2: ne? Ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, aber das liegt auch daran, dass Du's dir erst mal richtig gemacht hast.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das hab ich mich drauf eingestellt. Vollkommen ausm Konzept gebracht. Außer Intros wollen wir heute besprechen, was es bei Bun Neues gibt. Wir rannten ein bisschen über AI und Dennis hat zu guter Letzt noch die Apple Design Awards dabei, beziehungsweise ich glaub, die Finalisten erst oder so was, gell?\n\nSpeaker 1: Die Finalisten, ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Die Finalisten.\n\nSpeaker 1: Denn die WWDC kommt ja erst am Irgendwo, September oder? Juni. Achtter oder zehnter Juni oder so was. Montags.\n\nSpeaker 0: Speaking of WWDC. Dennis, Du hast da News dazu, hab ich gehört.\n\nSpeaker 1: Echt? Haben wir uns entschieden? Cool.\n\nSpeaker 0: Oh, wirklich. Du kannst das jetzt quasi live on air entscheiden.\n\nSpeaker 3: Du kannst\n\nSpeaker 1: das live entscheiden. Ja, wir hatten das, ich glaub, vorletztes Jahr, ich bin mir gar nicht sicher, ob wir das letztes Jahr auch angeboten haben. Nee, nee. Da meinte er nicht, nee. Wir haben ja sone Tradition, dass wir die WWWDC Keynote gar nicht jetzt gemeinsam gucken und danach eine Podcastfolge darauf aufnehmen und dazu aufnehmen und uns Hast\n\nSpeaker 2: Du gesagt, dass wir sie\n\nSpeaker 1: nicht gemeinsam gucken? Nein, wir gucken sie.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ah, wir gucken sie gemeinsam. Ich sag, also das Tradition ist, wie sie nicht gemeinsam gucken. Okay, ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und vor 2 Jahren haben wir dazu auf eingeladen, andere Programmierhörer*innen da draußen oder Programmierbar Fans einfach, dass die dazukommen können und mittels gucken können. Und das machen wir dieses Jahr jetzt einfach wieder. Wir bestellen ein bisschen Essen, je nachdem, wie viele Leute da sind, gibt's 'n bisschen was zu snacken, Getränke haben wir sowieso immer hier und dann gucken wir das ganze Ding danach. Machen wir noch schnell eine Live Podcast Folge und nehmen nehmen It's a Rap in knapper Stunde zusammengefasst, was 2 Stunden Präsentationen bei uns hätten auch zeigen können. Also ich gebe jetzt an ab an Jan, der euch sagt, ihr könnt euch anmelden über Okay.\n\nSpeaker 0: Bis ihr die Folge hört, haben wir das bestimmt auf Meetup Punkt com eingestellt, achter Juni. Ich hab grad noch mal nachgeschaut, das sicherzustellen. Da findet das statt. Und ich glaube, ich hab jetzt nicht die Zeitzone im Kopf, aber es müsste 7 Uhr Nein,\n\nSpeaker 2: 7 Uhr.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wieder, genau. Ja. Und dann fangen wir vielleicht wie gewohnt bei uns bei dem Meet Up so 6 oder so was an. Da mach ich ein bisschen hier die Schöne auf und dann schauen wir mal, was es so Neues gibt und über welche AI Fehltritte wir dieses Jahr lästern können oder so was.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich fand's sehr geil, dass es wirklich grade spontan entstanden ist. So diese Entscheidung, die grade spontan gefällt wurde, dann jetzt\n\nSpeaker 0: auch direkt von Jan. Sehr, ja, das ist mir Geil.\n\nSpeaker 2: Geil. Hat es doch\n\nSpeaker 0: tagelang darüber gefühlt geschrieben und jeder war so, ja, machen wir das jetzt oder machen wir das jetzt?\n\nSpeaker 2: Und dann hat\n\nSpeaker 0: er gesagt, okay, wir müssen uns Hat einfach heute entscheiden und dann Experiment. Ja, nee, nee, einfach so. Find\n\nSpeaker 2: ich gut. Das Ding ist, also wir sind nicht mal 'n Live Podcast, also wir können ja jetzt alles noch rausschneiden und so, aber wir machen das einfach so, als wär's live. Das ist krass. Ich glaub, wir haben wirklich noch nicht erschrocken. Ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: So verkacktes Intro könnte man noch mal neu machen. Aber nein.\n\nSpeaker 2: Wir haben nur den Intro. Sind wir nämlich.\n\nSpeaker 0: Die ungeschminkte Wahrheit gibt's nämlich bei der Programi war immer.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay. AI News, die wir gemeinsam uns anschauen. Wie, Dennis, wie macht ihr das eigentlich nächste Woche, wenn ihr wenn wir alle nicht hier sind? Macht ihr dann trotzdem AI News?\n\nSpeaker 1: Schön, dass Du's live ansprichst. Ich weiß es ehrlich gesagt nicht. Also tatsächlich Lotum hat den Luxus, wir sind wieder auf unserem jährlichen Lotum Wochenende und sind 4 Tage in Portugal und Portugal? In die Veröffentlichungszeitraum und auch in den Aufnahmeseite der normalen AI News. Warte, meine Aufnahmen kriegt\n\nSpeaker 2: man wahrscheinlich hinter Dienstag. Dienstag kann\n\nSpeaker 1: man noch hinkriegen. Also Aufnahme ist eigentlich okay. Jetzt musst Du sagen gern, ob Du Bock hast auf das öffentlichem Video hochladen, wenn wir\n\nSpeaker 2: auch alles live hier. Es ist alles geil.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich hab schon andere Podcasts vom Flughafen veröffentlicht, dass daran soll's nicht scheitern. Wir machen Okay.\n\nSpeaker 1: Also komm, lass uns das weitermachen, sonst wir haben doch total son totalen Streak seit ever. Jahren.\n\nSpeaker 2: Seit Jahren. Wunderbar. Eronen.\n\nSpeaker 1: War nix, ja. Gut. Nix mal auf.\n\nSpeaker 2: Jetzt aber ich würde ich weiß gar nicht genau, ob ich\n\nSpeaker 1: so ganz explizit gefragt habe, die Hörer*innen da draußen oder ob das einfach nur unser Gedankenspiel war. Wir überlegen ja, wie wir mit diesen beiden News Formaten weitermachen, weil wir hier auch immer viel über AI reden und ob's überhaupt noch Sinn macht, das Ganze zu trennen oder ob ihr das irgendwie zusammenbringen sollen. Also falls ihr da irgend einen Take zu habt, wollt ihr das gerne getrennt haben oder findet ihr's gut, wenn einfach die AI Themen, die jetzt nicht nur mehr Modelupdates sind, sondern vor allen Dingen Produkt und wie sind Prozesseoren, keine Ahnung, was solche Dinge, einfach auch in den normalen News besprochen werden. Und dann möchtet ihr es gerne als getrennte Formate haben, dann schreibt uns gerne an Podcast der Programmierpunkt bar.\n\nSpeaker 2: So ist es.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und weil wir, wie Dennis schon angefließt hat, auch in diesen Folgen immer nur über AI Themen sprechen, macht Dave direkt den Anfang und erzählt uns mal, was das bei Bun alles Neues gibt und was das mit AI zu tun hat. Ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja und andererseits Bun ist ja unser unser Steckenwert. Unser Herzensthema seit vielen Jahren.\n\nSpeaker 0: Also genau\n\nSpeaker 3: gelungen ist\n\nSpeaker 2: das. Sebi ist\n\nSpeaker 3: jetzt das Thema.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich wollt sagen, weiß ich nicht, das find ich so schön. Immer wenn's Band geht, muss jemand direkt an Sebi denken. Und das fühlt sich immer so an, als würd Sebi grad neben mir sitzen und mich streicheln. So, bisschen zu nah, die Lobmaschine hoch, aber jeden Fall, ich spür Sebi grade. Sebi spürt dich bestimmt auch grade.\n\nGenau, es geht Bun. Es geht gar nicht erst mal AI. Ja. Denn Jared Sumner, der Schöpfer von Bun, hat jetzt ein PR Gemerged. So weit, so unspannend erst mal, denkt man sich.\n\nDer Titel war aber schon sehr, sehr crazy. Titel war, also schon mal irgendwie schon krass. Wer's nicht wusste, vorher war's in Sig geschrieben.\n\nSpeaker 1: Einsatz, was Bun ist?\n\nSpeaker 2: Bun. Es ist für alles, was mit Java zu tun hat relevant. Also quasi man kennt ja Node und das ist einfach der komplette Tag von Node. Und wenn Du Java sagst, meinst Du, ja? Alter, das ist eher, ich bin wahrscheinlich immer nicht der Erste, dem was passiert ist, ja.\n\nGenau. Genau und genau, es war vorher in Sick geschrieben, kennt niemand und eigentlich Banden war so das größte Steckenpferd Ballerfinder,\n\nSpeaker 1: die das in Sick geschrieben haben.\n\nSpeaker 2: Sick.\n\nSpeaker 1: Sorry.\n\nSpeaker 2: Und es und es und das krasse ist aber jetzt, wenn man sich diese Dimension anschaut einfach von von von diesem PR, denn fast 2200 Filze wurden gechange und insgesamt 1000000 Zeilen Code wurden hinzugefügt. Es ist schon, also crazy natürlich, wenn man das hört, so ja okay, alles einfach rein und zack, merged. Jared selbst gibt da einige Vorteile an, hat gesagt, hey, ist runtergegangen 3 bis 8 Megabyte. Also da hat sich's schon mal 'n bisschen dafür gelohnt. Die haben zahlreiche Benchmarks auch gemacht, die neutral sind bis schneller so, was schon mal irgendwie ganz cool ist.\n\nUnd größter Vorteil, den Sie genannt haben, ist, dass die jetzt für die Entwicklung von Banden so Tools haben, wodurch paar Memory Leaks behoben wurden direkt und in Zukunft halt natürlich diese verhindert werden, da das Deloping einfacher ist. Hat damals sehr, sehr viel Zeit gekostet und wird jetzt halt quasi deutlich schneller gehen einfach. Wer will, kann das Ganze auch schon ausprobieren mit Bun Upgrade minus minus Kanary. Kann man das Ganze jetzt schon mit mit Rust testen. Aber ist ja jetzt die Frage so, was ist doch da nicht so spannend?\n\nJa. Also natürlich sieht man sich Dimension, 1000000 Signcall ist crazy so.\n\nSpeaker 1: Meine kleiner.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ist weißt ohne meine kleine Ecke, ist schon krass. Genau. Aber das Spannende daran ist und das ist natürlich grade für so ein AI Fanatiker, wie Dallas es ist, also krass, denn das das alles wurde mit AI neu geschrieben, komplett. Das also was ja schon mal an sich krass ist, ne, weil natürlich son von SIG zu Rust hätte wahrscheinlich vorher irgendwie mehrere Wochen, wenn nicht sogar Monate Zeit in Anspruch genommen, mehrere Entwickler, die da dran sind, das alles natürlich ausgiebig testen, was jetzt wahrscheinlich auch passiert ist, muss man sagen. Aber jetzt wurd es einfach in paar Tagen mit der RR runtergerattert.\n\nAlso ich glaub, das war unter eine Woche und dann hat er es einfach reingemerged, aber und das ist jetzt, wo mich dann eure Meinung gleich auch noch mal interessieren wird, aber auch natürlich muss man sagen, in der gesamten Community war es ein sehr, sehr kontroverses Thema, wenn nicht sogar polarisierend. Also es war wirklich krass, wenn man so diesen PR gesehen hat so, also waren 1600 Daumen hoch, genauso viele Daumen runter. Es gab viele Herzen, auch viele lachende Smileys, viele traurige Smileys und so. Und wenn man jetzt irgendwie Twitter, Reddit, Hacker News et cetera sich irgendwie anschaut, das ist also schon sehr, sehr heiß diskutiert. Natürlich also zum einen, weil's komplett mit BI gemacht wurde, ne.\n\nAlso das wird irgendwie so 'n ganzer so irgendwie, was schon irgendwie krass Aber natürlich auch sone Frage war, die aufgetaucht hat so, warum jetzt einmal der in Rust, ne? Das ist ja auch irgendwie sone berechtigte Frage. Man hat sich damals Physik entschieden, gab's wahrscheinlich auch Gründe für. Jetzt der ganze. Und tatsächlich haben sich da so 2 Lager gebildet, wo ich ehrlicherweise sagen muss, ich kann auch beide Seiten verstehen.\n\nOffiziell gibt es halt so 3 Gründe, warum das jetzt gemacht wurde. Das eine ist halt Ökosystem und. Sieg ist halt wahnsinnig jung. Ich glaub, die Sprache existiert vielleicht 10 Jahre, wenn nicht so weniger. Und eigentlich das gesamte Bunte musste alles neu schreiben.\n\nAlso egal, was sie brauchten, so die mussten das halt in Sigg erst mal selbst schreiben. Und natürlich Rust gibt's schon seit Ewigkeiten, hat 'n superkrasses Ökosystem, konnten das megageil nutzen. Punkt 2 ist Sicherheit und Memoryleaks. So SIG ist halt son bisschen ein bisschen niceres c oder so. Was heißt niceres c, aber auf jeden Fall sehr zehnar.\n\nDas heißt, man muss sich halt Speicherallokation und so was halt selbst kümmern. Das übernimmt halt Russ selbst mit diesem. Wer's noch nicht kennt, kannst Du mal nachschauen. Ist da halt dafür da, dass er halt das automatisch alles prüft, so, dass da keine Memoryleaks entstehen. Und natürlich, Punkt 3, was ich auch nachvollziehen kann, das Entwicklerökosystem.\n\nWeil wenn die natürlich irgendwie Teamunterstützung brauchen und sagen so, hey, wir suchen richtig gute SIG Entwickler so, gibt's halt keine so. Rust Entwickler gibt's natürlich wie Sand am Meer gefühlt und dass das durchaus auch 'n Grund war, offizielle Seite vom Bann. Aber kurzer Factcheck, Factcheck, die\n\nSpeaker 1: Fake Programmiersprache Rust gibt es seit 2016, also seit 11 Jahren.\n\nSpeaker 2: Wirklich? Bist Du dir sicher? Rust oder Sik?\n\nSpeaker 1: Davor wurde es schon bei Monzilla 5 Jahre lang entwickelt.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, es ist Aber es ist jetzt ja noch\n\nSpeaker 1: nicht so, weil Du hast gesagt, es ist Ewigkeit und uralt und keiner Ja,\n\nSpeaker 0: aber der Dave ist 'n junger Kerl, von dem ich Für mich sind\n\nSpeaker 2: 2 Jahre die Hälfte meiner Lebens sein.\n\nSpeaker 3: Hab ich\n\nSpeaker 1: gesagt, den gibt's seit 10 Jahren.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, okay, das ist das ist jetzt nicht so großer Unterschied. Genau, aber die sind aber die sind ja keine großen Playerhändler, ne, muss man ja aussagen. Ja, richtig. So, richtig. Genau und also so viel das offizielle Statement.\n\nEs soll auch 'n Blogpost kommen tatsächlich von Jared, der hat gesagt, also erst mal nur 'n p r gemacht. Blogpost wird auf jeden Fall noch mal folgen, war bis Stand heute noch nicht da. Gegenseite hat natürlich gesagt so, na ja, irgendwie fühlt sich's an wie einfach nur 'n AI Showcase ehrlicherweise, ne. Also ich glaub, wir haben auch vor ungefähr 'nem halben Jahr, es müsste, glaub ich, so irgendwie Dezember gewesen sein, haben wir darüber berichtet, dass Anthropic Bun gekauft hat, ne, bei soner Acquisition. Ich glaub, Fabi hat damals drüber erzählt.\n\nUnd natürlich kann man jetzt sagen, sone Anthropic will halt zeigen so, hey, guck mal, was Claude alles kann, ne. Hier Bun kennt ihr ja alle, superbeliebtes Produkt, supergroßes Open Source Produkt und hier allein mit Claude konnten wir jetzt alles einfach rüber machen zu Rust Und das ist einfach son Vorzeigeprojekt dafür, ne. Muss man auch ehrlicherweise sagen, da ist auch ein Stück Wahrheit dran, denn es ist natürlich, was immer heiß diskutiert wird, wie viel Ai Slop ist da drin? Und der Faktor ist durchaus vorhanden, muss man sagen, denn ich habe ja vorhin diesen angesprochen, der so Memory leaks verhindert, ne. Und das halt also der große Vorteil eigentlich an Rust.\n\nUnd den kann man aber auch deaktivieren, indem man einfach schreibt und dann alles, was da ist, so sagst Du quasi dem dem Rust Compiler so, ja, ja, ich ich achte darauf, dass hier alles sicher ist. Und damit umgehst Du halt eigentlich das Ganze und es wurd halt einfach quasi 1 zu 1 von SEK übersetzt so. Also quasi Du hast halt kein idiomatisches Rust, sondern es ist halt wirklich einfach nur 'n 1 zu 1 Import, ohne wirklich die die Sprache zu berücksichtigen. Wurde aber auch an der Stelle von Jared schon gesagt so, hey, ja, ja, wissen wir, da kommen 'n paar Follow-upares, ne? Das wird wahrscheinlich auch alles mit der AI immer stückweise dann noch mal nachgeliefert, ne.\n\nAber ist ist trotzdem so, dass das Stimmungsbild dadurch irgendwie trotzdem 'n bisschen negativ war, sag ich mal. Und jetzt vielleicht son bisschen so meine Meinung und auch danach gerne eure so. Also erstens, ich find das schon also wahnsinnig beeindruckend so, ne. Ich meine, also das ist schon krasser Scale, erst mal so 1000000 Zeilencodes so irgendwie noch mal, das komplett irgendwie umgeschrieben. Es also also es ist funktional, meine Relieaks wurden behoben so, es ist auch kleiner geworden so.\n\nIrgendwie ist es schon auf jeden Fall beeindruckend, ne, weil man sich so was vorher gar nicht vorstellen konnte. Vor allem grad, ne, in dieser Diskussion davon, man hätt sich wahrscheinlich länger überlegt so, ja, lohnt sich jetzt dieser Reeride? Machen wir das wirklich? Wie viele Entwickler brauchen wir? Wie lange dauert das?\n\nWas ist dann so der Outcom Ende? So und wahrscheinlich würd's man's eher nicht machen oder sehr stark depriorisieren oder man hätten noch mal oder müssen wir sagen, hey, das muss ich halt noch x Jahre rentieren, damit sich dieser Revit jetzt lohnt. Von daher ist jetzt irgendwie einfach krass, so diesen Schritt zu machen, na ja, wir machen's einfach. So, das find ich also schon irgendwie ganz cool. Und weil da ja auch irgendwie viele Leute so bisschen Sorgen hatten, na ja, das ist jetzt irgendwie alles fehleranfälliger und das wird dann irgendwie auch mal crashen und das ist nicht mehr so gut benutzbar wie davor.\n\nIch hab tatsächlich also so zum einen irgendwie relativ viel Trust in der AI tatsächlich einfach so was umzuschreiben, so. Ich denk mir so irgendwie, das das kann das gut. Und zweitens hab ich auch irgendwie 'n starken Trust in einfach. Erstens, weil's halt sone sehr stark basierte Sprache ist.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und auch schon sehr lange.\n\nSpeaker 2: Und gibt's auch schon sehr lange.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich mein, man kann ja auch gar nicht ohne schreiben, ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, eben, eben, das steckt hier sogar einfach drin. Krass.\n\nSpeaker 1: Alter, so, David's nicht schlecht.\n\nSpeaker 3: Ja, aber\n\nSpeaker 2: es war es war wirklich gut. 80 Prozent Trust ist. Genau, und dann jedenfalls diese starke Typisierung. Das heißt eigentlich, der der Compiler wird ja vorher fehlschlagen, wenn irgendwas auch schlecht halt umgeschrieben ist, so. Das heißt, Du kannst halt irgendwie nicht so fehlerhaften Coach schreiben wie beispielsweise bei JavaScript oder so was alles, ne, der dann halt erst so zu knallt.\n\nVon daher ist irgendwie so, dass also mein mein Glaube daran, dass das echt gut funktioniert hat, sehr hoch. Ist spannend, das auf jeden Fall auszuprobieren. Und irgendwie irgendwie auch cool, son bisschen diese Vorreiterstellung von Band zu sagen, ja, wisst ihr was? Komm, wir machen einfach und machen das und diese bisschen diese Vorreiterstellung so. Find ich geil so einfach so von der Attitude.\n\nAber genau, auch außer spannend natürlich, was ihr dazu sagt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Mich, also mich wundert das gar nicht so sehr, dass dieser geklappt hat wie dich, glaub ich. Insbesondere, wenn man sich anschaut, dass, wie Du ja gesagt hast, sie einfach nur viel sick in Rust portiert haben und halt nicht rustspezifische Sachen irgendwie verwendet haben. Ich glaube, Mhm. Interessanter wäre gewesen, wenn sie wirklich sone Cleanroom Implementation gemacht hätten, gesagt hätten, hier ist die Testsuite von bun. So, das ist alles, was funktionieren muss.\n\nUnd jetzt baust Du quasi so lange, bis Du halt all diese Tests irgendwie hinkriegst, ja, aber ohne die bestehende Code Base halt anzugucken. Einfach nur, auch halt fresh. Weil was dabei rauskommt, wär wahrscheinlich 'n viel nativeres Produkt gewesen. True. Und da hätte er dann wirklich mal schauen können, okay, wie viel Unterschied ergibt sich halt wirklich, ja?\n\nJetzt ist, glaub ich, eher das Spannende, was im Nachgang damit passiert, ob diese ganzen Sick Artefakte, die jetzt in der Code Base drin sind, ob die halt noch aufgeräumt werden und wenn ja, ob das von Hand gemacht werden muss und ob das auch maschinell passiert und wie groß dann der Performancegain halt irgendwie ist, ja? Weil wenn sie jetzt, wie Du am Anfang gesagt hast, so paritär da irgendwie unterwegs sind, sich ungefähr gleich verhalten von Performance und so was, obwohl sie noch diese ganze im Prinzip mitportiert haben, ja, Mhm. Dann steht ja eigentlich zu hoffen, dass, wenn das mal ordentlich aufgeräumt ist, es dann wirklich noch besser werden kann.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: Aber ansonsten glaube ich, getestete Projekte zu portieren ist wahrscheinlich sogar einfacher, als wenn ich ihm jetzt die ungetestete programmierbarplattform hinwerfen würde und sagen würde, portier mir das mal zu oder Go oder keine Ahnung was. Ja. Wo dann vorne und hinten alles kaputtgeht.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das wär auch mein Take. Also ich glaube immer son son viel genutztes öffentliches Ding, Frameworkprojekt, was auch immer, was eine hohe Testabdeckung hat, da ist es natürlich wirklich 'n Einfacheres, das in in ähnlicher Qualität irgendwie irgendwie nachzubauen Und trotzdem natürlich beeindruckend, dass das geht in dem Skate und dass einfach dann irgendwo mehr oder weniger funktioniert und auch in diesem Zeitrahmen funktioniert. Und grundsätzlich ist es, glaub ich, am Ende würde ich jetzt, ohne jetzt in den Details drin zu sein, würd ich sagen, hörst Du dir erst mal nach 'ner vernünftigen Entscheidung an. Ich mein, wir werden uns immer weiter dahin entwickeln, dass viel mehr Teile von AI umgesetzt werden. Und wenn jetzt auch das eine Entscheidung ist, dass es halt viel mehr Trainingsdaten, Ressourcen et cetera in in Rust gibt, das Ganze zu machen und dass die Sprache, also womit das einfacher funktioniert.\n\nJa, ja klar. Und man sicherer ist und so und und und so weiter, dann macht das Sinn. Und wenn Du halt einfach so wechseln kannst und jetzt ist die Hoffnung, dass da nicht massiv technische Schulden irgendwie aufgebaut wurden, aber dafür, wie gesagt, funktioniert es ja erst mal und ist nicht schlechter, beziehungsweise teilweise besser, Mhm. Dann kann man daran ja jetzt genauso mit AI rumoptimieren und die nächsten 100 generieren lassen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich frag mich, wie sehr sich Microsoft grade son bisschen geärgert fühlt, weil die doch vor 'n paar Monaten diesen irgendwie angekündigt haben und das son ewig langes Projekt ist und sie so ultravorsichtig mit, wie machen wir diese Transition und bla bla bla so, ja. Und wenn jetzt ab wann einfach so die Ecke kommt, so, ja, ich hab da mal nachts irgendwie sonen Purry Quest aufgemacht Ist\n\nSpeaker 2: auch schon gemerkt. So, ja, ja, das macht schon alles. Ja, stimmt. Und jetzt\n\nSpeaker 0: ist Fedic, das ist natürlich auch son son krasses Kontrastprogramm, ja, wo man Ja. Ja eigentlich auch Microsoft unterstellen könnte, dass sie so die Power von Open AI irgendwie haben und das natürlich auch für 'n cooler cooler Move so sein könnte.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, aber hey, also ja. Und grade solche Use Cases braucht es ja auch, irgendwie zu demonstrieren, ne, was was irgendwie möglich ist. Ich finde, das ist ja auch immer noch 1, also und wenn es ne zu gehört, ist das halt mit Sicherheit Teil davon irgendwie zu zeigen, so was. Was sind die Möglichkeiten? Würde mich ja noch mal super interessieren so, was dann am Ende die Kosten auch waren beziehungsweise ne, also das\n\nSpeaker 2: ist ja dann vielleicht immer\n\nSpeaker 1: noch mal 'n anderes Setting, wenn Du so inhouse als Dropic Test machst, was was Ressourcengeschwindigkeit Komplett getroffen,\n\nSpeaker 2: ballert, Phasen,\n\nSpeaker 1: 1000 Sub Agents, keine Ahnung. Aber kommt vielleicht in den Blogposten noch 'n bisschen was.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja, genau. Ich glaub, da wird das noch mal 'n bisschen elaborierter aufgedröselt, was alles war. Ja. Kein Take mehr. Ja, krass, nur durchaus positiv in der Runde.\n\nSpeaker 1: Komm, dafür jetzt kommt Jan.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich wollt grad sagen, son bisschen. Tour noch sone Stimmung zu kippen hier.\n\nSpeaker 2: Genau. Warum ist Antropic scheiße, Jan?\n\nSpeaker 0: Na, also okay, vielleicht kurzer Disclaimer vorne ab so. Ich hasse nicht allgemein AI, auch wenn Dennis mir das immer so unterstellt. Ich benutze AI gerne, vielleicht 'n bisschen kritischer als manch andere oder so. Ja, aber ich hab trotzdem irgendwie Spaß damit. Aber und ich glaub, diese Diskussion hat angefangen in unserer letzten AI Week, ne.\n\nDa hatten wir son paar Diskussionen hier geführt, mal 'n bisschen länger und haben uns son bisschen angefangen, damit zu beschäftigen, so okay, was für was fürn moralischen Anspruch muss man eigentlich an son legitime Frage ist aus 2 Gründen. Also ne, warum stellt man sich nicht dieselben Fragen bei jedem Datenbankanbieter oder Hoster oder so was, den man verwendet, ja? Also warum werden die Leute bei AI irgendwie viel kritischer? Ich glaub zum einen, weil natürlich alle irgendwie bemüht sind, diesen Systemen irgendwie maximal viel Autonomie und und Spielraum und am Ende halt auch irgendwie Geld rüberzuschieben so, ja. Und mit mehr Anforderung kommt halt auch irgendwie mehr Erwartungshaltung.\n\nUnd wenn sich natürlich alle diese Anbieter irgendwie auf die Fahne schreiben, dass sie hier irgendwie AGI erreichen wollen und superautonome menschliche Agenten bauen und bla bla bla, da ist natürlich so ihr Verhalten auch son bisschen Rückspiegelung auf, na ja, wie verhalten sich halt dieses oder was kann man von diesem System am Ende des Tages erwarten, ja? Und deshalb gibt's da, glaub ich, generell eine eine andere Erwartungshaltung. So. Mit dem, ja. Ich hab, glaub ich, sone sehr Achterbahnartige Reise da irgendwie hinter mir und mich würde mal so euer Take dazu interessieren, weil gefühlt sind es ja immer so Zyklen von 1 von diesen Anbietern macht irgendwie was mega Cooles und alle springen drauf und dann werden wir irgendwie enttäuscht.\n\nSo. Also Open AI war superlange irgendwie das das Lieblingskind von allen, ja, insbesondere ganz, ganz, ganz am Anfang, als sie noch mit so offenen GPT Modellen gearbeitet hat. Man konnte die Paper dazu lesen, man konnte das selber ausprobieren. Sie hatten irgendwie so diesen Ansatz von, wir sind hier dieses Non profit Lab, was irgendwie nur Gutes erreichen will und sammeln dafür Venturekapital ein, aber verballern das eigentlich, hier so die Menschheit voranzubringen und alle so yeah und das klappt schon. Sie hatten irgendwie eigene Teams dafür, die sich damit beschäftigt haben.\n\nNa ja,\n\nSpeaker 2: Kurze Frage war das war das noch zu GPT-zwei-Zeiten oder wann war das?\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, das war so GPT generell und GPT-zwei und so, so wirklich ganz früh. Wir sind hier so Ja, wir sind 20, 18, 19. Ja, krass. Ne, also sehr gut.\n\nSpeaker 2: Also jetzt hab ich auch was Neues gelernt, das muss ich gar nicht. Was war das?\n\nSpeaker 1: TypT 2?\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, da war ich noch bei Shopify Lass es mal 21 oder 22 gewesen sein. Okay. Nicht früher, JPC 2 und 3, ne?\n\nSpeaker 2: Mhm. Okay, so weiter im Text.\n\nSpeaker 0: Auf alle Fälle und bla bla bla. Und dann haben sie halt irgendwie so angefangen, sobald sie gesehen haben, oh, man kann aus ChatGPT irgendwie 'n cooles Produkt machen und lass doch mal diesen Non Profit Ansatz über Bord schmeißen und damit irgendwie ordentlich Geld verdienen und lass doch auch mal dieses Safety und Alignment Team irgendwie rausschmeißen. Die halten uns nur alle irgendwie zurück. Und dann diese ganze Geschichte, wie sie Sam Ortman gefeuert haben und wieder reingeholt haben und dann das halbe Board rausgeschmissen und so. Also es hat halt irgendwie alles son sehr faden Beigeschmack von dieser dieser moralische Kompass, den man irgendwie am Anfang zugetraut hat.\n\nDer ist halt irgendwie verloren gegangen so in in the process, so. Dann kommt irgendwie auf die Bühne. Ich glaub, 20 21, 22 haben die auch damit angefangen, mit Leuten, von Leuten gegründet, die bei OpenAI rausgegangen sind, weil sie halt genau das bemängelt haben, ne, gesagt haben, oh, zu viel Kommerz, zu wenig Sicherheit. Wir wir machen das anders. Wir machen hier 'n Safety First AI Laden auf und wir haben irgendwie Grundsätze und wollen das durchziehen und und bla.\n\nUnd das war irgendwie da alles wieder cool und alle hatten irgendwie ihr neues Lieblings AI Kind gefunden und sind da irgendwie drauf gesprungen. Und dann, na ja, also es war von Anfang an vielleicht son bisschen schwierig mit denen, wenn man da guckt, wer da auch vielleicht als Investor dringesessen hat und wie das alles so funktioniert hat, aber auf alle Fälle\n\nSpeaker 2: Wer denn zum Beispiel?\n\nSpeaker 1: Der gehört ja, weißt Du?\n\nSpeaker 0: Also, ne, man ist jetzt eine andere Diskussion, wie weit will man quasi ein Unternehmen dafür verantwortlich machen, wer da als Investor drinsitzt und wie die sich verhalten, ja. Aber wenn man sich anguckt, dass da irgendwie so Sam Bankman Fried, der ja mit FTX diesen großen Krypto Scam quasi an die Wand gefahren hat, der hat da irgendwie, glaub ich, am Anfang 'n paar 100000000 Dollar reingesteckt, das aufzubauen, so schwierig. Mhm. Anyway, Intropic geht irgendwie durch die Decke, alles megacool, bis sie jetzt anfangen. Komische Sachen mit Pricing und SDK Restriktions und wer darf überhaupt unsere API nutzen und für was und überhaupt.\n\nDa kann man doch sagen, na ja, ne, ist halt 'n Business. Die dürfen selber entscheiden, wem sie ihr Produkt verkaufen. Haben sie ja im im Pentagon Fall auch irgendwie gemacht und da waren wir alle irgendwie auf ihrer Seite zu sagen, so hey, verkauft das mal nicht irgendwie an die Rüstungsindustrie, das ist alles cool. Mhm. Und dann kamen da so Deals wie, ja, ja, zahlt jetzt jeden Monat irgendwie anderthalb Milliarden Dollar oder so was an xA I, ihre Datencenter zu mieten.\n\nDas vielleicht auch irgendwie uncool und man will nicht das Geld irgendwie dahin geht, weil Ex und Grok und Musk irgendwie son ganz komischer eigener Sumpf sind. Und den finanziert man jetzt quasi sehr direkt mit, wenn man irgendwie 'n nutzt, weil sie halt auf die Hardware und die Rechenzentren von denen angewiesen sind. Schwierig, schwierig, schwierig. Dann gab's irgendwie noch Mysteral aus Europa und alle so, weniger Abhängigkeit irgendwie nach nach USA und die haben sich auf die Fahne geschrieben, dass irgendwie auch so Open Source AI zu bauen und irgendwie Independence halt für diesen ganzen US Tech Konzernen aufzubauen und haben dann auch son bisschen gelobyt gegen den oder an dem EU AI Act rumzuschrauben, dass es halt nicht zu strengen wird und dass wir ja auch eigene Sachen aufbauen können und son bisschen mit diesen Frontier Labs aus Nordamerika konkurrieren können und bla. Bis sie dann, nachdem das halt irgendwie alles durch waren, gesagt haben, na\n\nSpeaker 3: ja, wir\n\nSpeaker 0: machen jetzt halt sonen exklusiven Deal mit Microsoft. Das mit diesem ganzen Open Source EU Zeug, das müssen wir eigentlich alles gar nicht so wichtig nehmen Und wir vertreiben jetzt unser Zeug exklusiv eben über Microsoft, die investieren, die kriegen hier 'n Anteil bei uns und das war irgendwie dahin mit der schönen EU Souveränität. Und das, also ich weiß nicht, man kann hier noch, man können bestimmt auch über Google reden. Ich weiß nicht, ob wir über Meta und Excel noch getrennt reden müssen, aber die Story ist halt gefühlt immer dasselbe. Es kommt 'n cooles Produkt raus, ja.\n\nLama haben auch irgendwie alle abgefeiert am Anfang, als es frisch und neu war. Und dann irgendwie kippt diese ganze Geschichte wieder. Und gefühlt sitze ich immer da, wenn ich diese Produkte benutze und freu mich, wie cool sie funktionieren und fühl mich gleichzeitig so schlecht dabei, wo sie irgendwie so herkommen, ja? Und da würde mich mal mal euer Take interessieren.\n\nSpeaker 2: Oh, ich find einfach so, das das größte Thema ist ja einfach hier, also Wirtschaftlichkeit, oder? Also ich glaub, das ist halt so einfach so der größte Knackpunkt und also ne, man man man man kann mit 'ner gewissen Moralvorstellung ja auch irgendwie in die Sache reingehen und und für etwas stehen, Aber man weiß ja auch, wie wie wie teuer einfach dieser gesamte AI Kram ist so, ne. Sei es halt in der Forschung, sei es das dann auch zu betreiben und so was alles. Und ich kann mir das schon durchaus, was jemand sagt, na ja, es muss halt irgendwie wirtschaftlich sein am Ende oder wir gehen halt irgendwie pleite und zum Teil musst Du dann son bisschen vielleicht dein deine Werte verkaufen und sagen, hey, okay, ja gut, dann ist jetzt irgendwie Microsoft da, die uns da voll viel Geld für geben. Das finanziert uns auf jeden Fall und wir können weiter irgendwie coole Dinge machen.\n\nDie andere Option wäre, na ja, es ist nicht wirtschaftlich, es es passt halt irgendwie nicht weiter. Und ich glaub, das ist halt son bisschen leider irgendwie sone notgedrungene Sache dann immer an der Stelle, halt weil's halt eben so teuer ist. Ich glaub, das ist so durchaus der größte Faktor. Und ich glaub und dann kann man natürlich dann entscheiden so, wie also wie betrachten man das Ganze moralisch so. Das wär natürlich die nächste Frage.\n\nTja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Kann man wahrscheinlich, ja, kann man wahrscheinlich wieder sehr, also entweder mit 'nem sehr pessimistischen oder optimistischen Blick irgendwie drauf gucken, weil Du hast am Anfang ja auch selbst den Vergleich gezogen, ja, zu den ganzen anderen Dingen, die wir irgendwie nutzen und wo wir uns vielleicht nicht so viele Gedanken machen. Und vielleicht ist da das da irgendwo vergleichbar. Also ne, ist jetzt die Google Cloud oder die ABS Cloud oder ne, was also oder auch einfach jegliches jegliche Dienst, den man hat mit Linear, mit wo zahlen wir noch viel? Miro, Slack.\n\nSpeaker 2: Atlas. Atlas,\n\nSpeaker 1: Ne, keine Ahnung was. Das sind ja überall alles so Fragen, jetzt speziell bei uns. Wir sind ziemlich groß auf der auf Facebook, Instant Games so als Partner mit mit Matter. Finde ich schwierig und ja klar ist es dann auch noch mal, aber ich glaub, das ist dann irgendwie auch dann am Ende irgendwie die Realität, die dann auf die Unternehmen so niederprasselt, ne, wenn Du irgendwie da startest und sagst, hey, wir sind die Guten und wir machen das jetzt so moralisch alles richtig und haben irgendwo auch diese Ansprüche, das zerschellt dann vielleicht einfach son bisschen an der harten Realität, weil\n\nSpeaker 3: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 1: Wenn Du's dann nicht veröffentlichst beispielsweise, ne, irgendwie jetzt einen Modell und sagst, ja, nee, da müssen wir noch 'n bisschen gucken und Training, keine Ahnung was, dann macht's halt 'n anderer und verdient halt dann vor dir das Geld damit und Du bist vielleicht abgeschnitten. Und natürlich ist das irgendwo gesellschaftlich kacke, dass es so ist, aber ich mein, das ist halt irgendwie der Kapitalismus, in dem wir leben und wo es halt darum geht, möglichst erfolgreich am Markt zu sein. Wenn die sich jetzt alle zusammenschließen würden und sagen würden, ja, lass uns das mal irgendwie, ne, vernünftig gemeinsam machen, dann hätten wir als Menschheit wahrscheinlich mehr davon, aber so hat's halt noch nie funktioniert. Und auf der einen Seite treibt es natürlich auch die Innovation voran, ne, dass es möglichst schnell irgendwie sich weiterentwickeln muss und man da deswegen auch, also dass der Mit der Grund ist, dass wir halt diese rasante Weiterentwicklung haben, weil all die Milliarden irgendwie da reingegossen werden. Und wahrscheinlich musst Du dann irgendwie so selbst sein den den das kleinste Übel für dich selbst irgendwie rausfinden.\n\nUnd ich mein, es gibt halt auch noch die Extreme, ne. Ich würd's auch noch nie hier so diskutiert, also deshalb irgendwie ja, bei bei Musk, von dem ich vor, man, Kameras draus, 16 Jahren, ne, irgendwie 'n großer, was heißt 'n großer Fan war, weil ich fand das schon irgendwo über sehr lange Zeit sehr beeindruckend. Ich hab das sehr nah verfolgt, alles, was er so gemacht hat und hab mir gedacht, okay, Wahnsinn, ne. Wie wie kann 1 das so irgendwie parallel, ist man unabhängig, wie viele davon wirklich irgendwie selbst gemacht hat, aber es drehte sich halt einfach sehr viel seine Person und er hat sehr, sehr viel bewegt und und war da total begeistert vor und dann dann fragst Du dich, wie kann jemand, ne, so irgendwie, weiß ich nicht, abrutschen oder in in ins Falsche, ja, abdrehen und dann in hinten die falschen Kontakte irgendwie kommen. Und irgendwie ist es ja auch natürlich, ich mein, ich mein, wenn Du dir Wie sollst Du wie sollst Du normal bleiben, wenn Du der reichste Mensch der Welt bist, so?\n\nAlso da da brauchst Du irgendwie besondere besondere Grundlagen irgendwie, dass dass das passiert. Und Du kannst ja wirklich Sachen machen. Ich mein, Du Du bist dann je näher, die die, ne, die die erste, keine Ahnung, das erste Mal eine Rakete wieder aufgefangen hat. Also Du bist natürlich das nicht, aber halt irgendwie die Unternehmen, für die Du dich verantwortlich zeichnest. Und dass Du da irgendwann dann halt, ja, bisschen gaga wirst, das kann ich schon irgendwie auch nachvollziehen.\n\nSpeaker 3: Ich würd\n\nSpeaker 1: dir Und so ähnlich ist es wahrscheinlich auch.\n\nSpeaker 2: Auslux mit Elon Musk war einfach so, oh, ich hab den ja nicht schon da eigentlich gemacht.\n\nSpeaker 0: Eigentlich mehr so zu Dennis' persönlicher Reise gegangen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ach wisst ihr auch, Blau ist by the way meine Lieblingsfarbe. Schon. Genau, aber jetzt aber den Übergang. Genug Kontext zu Elon Musk und dann und so ähnlich ist es auch Ja,\n\nSpeaker 1: genau, also und da ist es irgendwie dann so der für uns jetzt hier in, ja, ist für viele, glaube ich, in Deutschland und so ist es da irgendwie sone harte oder eine klare Grenze, wo man irgendwann gesagt hat, okay, das geht uns dann zu weit mit, ne, Trump Support und im und in der Regierung sitzen und so was. Und da meine ich nur, da muss wahrscheinlich jeder für sich irgendwo halt diese Grenzen irgendwie ausloten und sagen, okay, ab wann ist es was, wo es mich stört. Ab wann ist es halt irgendwie unterliegen und mit dem wir uns irgendwie zurechtfinden müssen. Das muss man ja auf Unternehmensweise auch. Ich mein, kann man jetzt Clayd oder OpenAI boykottieren einfach nur aus diesen Gründen oder ist der Schaden dann für die eigene Firma auch wieder so groß, weil man halt nicht das das Beste und die die die größten Modelle nutzt so?\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich musste mich, ich ich war hart an den Batman Film erinnert. Jetzt weiß leider nicht, in welchem von der Trilogie das war. Ich glaub eine Dark Knight Rights. Wenn er sagt, so. So gefühlt verhalten sich ja diese ganzen Airi Labs.\n\nSo die starten alle superoptimistisch und irgendwann, wie Du schon sagst, ne, treffen sich halt auch sone sone harte Realität, mit der sie halt irgendwie Mhm. Umgehen müssen. Was ja vielleicht aber auch gar nicht so schlimm wäre, wenn sie sich das vorher gar nicht so stark auf die Banner geschrieben hätten, ja. Also dadurch entsteht ja dieser Kontrast. Und ich glaube, das macht auch sone Unterschied aus zu dem, was Du grade selber sagtest, dann hör mal zu zu Facebook, zu Google Cloud Hosting zu, keine Ahnung, ne.\n\nGoogle Cloud Hosting ist nie gestartet mit, wir sind hier, weil wir 'n moralischen Kompass haben und die Welt besser machen wollen, so, ja. Und und scheitern dann daran, sondern die sind halt 'n relativ transparentes Unternehmen, so. Natürlich hat Google irgendwann mal so ganz, ganz früher mit Do No Evil und so was angefangen, aber das ist ja schon, also das das glaubt, glaube ich,\n\nSpeaker 1: keiner mehr. Ja, genau. Aber ja, richtig, richtig, aber das, ey, ich mein, da kannst Du doch die gleiche Geschichte auch erzählen. Ich mein, irgendwo haben sie das doch genauso gesagt und wollten die Welt seine Besserung und Apple doch auch. Ich mein, die sehen sich doch schon auch als Weltverbesserer.\n\nSpeaker 2: Aber na ja und und die die\n\nSpeaker 0: haben halt immerhin ehrlicherweise dann mit diesem AI Shit aufgehört, ne. So, die haben gesagt, so so wie wir das haben wollen würden, unseren Ansprüchen gerecht zu werden, so kriegen wir das nicht gebaut. Ja, Ja. Schalten wir nicht. Ist ja so.\n\nMhm.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, wir\n\nSpeaker 0: wir können kein Siri bauen, was Privatsphäre so respektiert, was was nicht halluziniert, unseren Ansprüchen gerecht zu werden, dann lassen wir's lieber. Das ist ja auch irgendwie eine Alternative, ja. Und das meine ich halt so, diese diese diese Diskrepanz zwischen Anspruch und Möglichkeit, das ist, glaube ich, das, was für mich so frustrierend ist und gar nicht dieses kapitalistisch. Also ich mein, da muss man sich ja überhaupt keine Illusion hingeben, Mhm. Dass hier nicht jeder Player auch Teil dieses Systems ist, so.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Aber halt auch bei Apple\n\nSpeaker 1: ist es natürlich eine Lücke mit irgendwie Privacy und Datenschutz und so was, die sie natürlich marketingtechnisch irgendwann, ne, wo sie gemerkt haben, also da waren sie halt sehr, sehr schlau, sehr früh, aber dass das 'n Ding wird und haben halt dadurch aber mit Sicherheit auch aus Business Perspektive so, ne, dass das was ist, womit man Geld machen kann, auf Privatsphäre zu setzen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Aber was mich jetzt an der Stelle interessieren würde, ich sag's dir, Jan oder Dennis, wie war das eigentlich bei Elon Musk,\n\nSpeaker 0: Eigentlich Elon Musks\n\nSpeaker 2: Privatsphäre. Das\n\nSpeaker 0: ist doch Genau, genau.\n\nSpeaker 2: Und zwar aber, also weil Du's grade so gesagt hast, so von wegen, ja, Google schreibt sich das nicht auf die Fahne, aber propagieren oder haben das diese AI Unternehmen davor so krass propagiert? Son Entropic oder auch son Mystereier, dass die gesagt haben, ja, ja, wir sind die Weltwörter, sondern wir machen das auf eine gute Art und Weise. Also ich hatte eher das Gefühl, die wurden halt einfach so Drive by sympathisch, ne. Also irgendwie so, ja, wir, ne, Entropic, die gesagt haben, wir wollen nicht, dass das für militärische Zwecke benutzt wird. Also das haben die aus freien Städte, ja irgendwie so bisschen gesagt.\n\nHaben die sich wirklich so positioniert?\n\nSpeaker 1: Also das ist\n\nSpeaker 2: ja die Frage, ja. Ja, okay. Dann Nein. Ich hasse nicht übernehmen, nein.\n\nSpeaker 0: Okay, genug Aber ich fand der E-Roll.\n\nSpeaker 1: Nein, wirklich\n\nSpeaker 2: Wann nehmen wir das Elon Musk Special auf.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ich weiß nicht mehr genau, wie diese Zeiten waren, aber so ich hab wirklich, fast alle Präsentationen so was geguckt, weil ich das einfach, ich fand, der hat die Welt so irgendwie, ich fand, der hat die Welt schön erklärt, so als es diese ersten Solasachen gab und so was. Und sonst hörte sich so alles sinnvoll und hey, wir können das machen und das ist alles, dann fixen wir das und alles gut und so. Es war Ist\n\nSpeaker 0: ist die erste Frage ist doch Dennis, warum hast Du nie 'n Tesla gehabt? Bis jetzt.\n\nSpeaker 1: Nee, weil sie, ja, jetzt schließe ich's ja aus, aber weil sie mir zu lange noch zu teuer waren und ich nicht so viel Geld für 'n Auto ausgeben wollte. Also ich konnte es mir in dem Sinne noch nicht leisten und dann war der Moment, vorbei auf die Eltern, die ich mir gegangen bist, wo ich's hätte machen können. Ja. Aber ja, ist krass. Also ich mein, ja, ich hab es jahrelang gefeiert und da geht das Update verfolgt so, was das angeht.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Aber ich bin nicht gefragt, ist der Musk überhaupt 'n guter Speaker? Weißt Du jetzt,\n\nSpeaker 1: guck ich mir die chinesischen\n\nSpeaker 2: Euros an. Ja, also der der fühlt es richtig und der kann das mit Überzeugung rüberbringen und sag, hey, guck mal, das ist das geilste Ding, was ich in der Handhaber so der Welt so. Es gibt nichts Krasseres als dieses iPhone hier so. Das fand ich schon bei Steve Jobs irgendwie ganz cool so. Das kam auch sehr authentisch drüber.\n\nBei Musk, ich hab nur so, glaub ich, eine Präsentation, die macht mir so, ja, es ist okay. So, ich weiß nicht, er hat mir irgendwie als als Er war\n\nSpeaker 1: kein, nein, der war kein ja, ja und nein. Also er war kein guter Speaker. Er ist kein guter Speaker,\n\nSpeaker 0: aber er ist 'n guter Nerd.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja und aber Du hast ihn dadurch das noch mal so mehr abgekauft, dass er halt darüber so nachgedacht hat und gesagt hat, ja, machen wir\n\nSpeaker 0: das so.\n\nSpeaker 1: Er war so auch in diesen Präsentationen. Du warst halt irgendwie, das hörte sich sehr sinnvoll und sehr bar an, so, was er gesagt hat. Natürlich war er nicht so shiny und vorbereitet, ne. Es war ihm alles verspätet, das war und so weiter. Es war also, was die Präsentationsthemen angeht, ja.\n\nVielleicht zu dem, was Apple gemacht hat. Ja. Aber trotzdem einfach von den Ideen so, dass Du dachtest so, das ist, so geht das sehr easy. Klar, schließen wir unsere Kabel im Kopf an und fahren dann autonom besser. Also.\n\nSpeaker 0: Schön. Okay. Die Folge noch mal 'n bisschen positiv zu drehen, lassen\n\nSpeaker 2: wir dir bitte.\n\nSpeaker 0: Dir bitte. Was zu den Designer Walls erzählen. Alter.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das auch noch. Haben wir nicht gesagt? Das Thema was? Hast Du gesagt? Das ist eine kurze Folge.\n\nWas steht auf dem Regal?\n\nSpeaker 0: Echt, nein.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ach, 'n neues Ach, mal.\n\nSpeaker 2: Deswegen ist ja immer gesagt, es wird die kürzeste Folge ever. Mhm. Dave hat's halt gegen weich falsch.\n\nSpeaker 0: Das sollte man halt einfach vor der Aufnahme nicht sagen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Na ja, deswegen weiß ich nicht mehr, ich bin einzige, der also 'n Thema vorbereitet hat so und ihr nicht zu sehen, dass ich mir\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich war vorbereitet. Hallo? Hallo. Ja, aber\n\nSpeaker 2: das ist ja son Gedankenspiel. Ja, doch. Das ist schon okay. Ja. Dennis.\n\nWas ist das denn überhaupt?\n\nSpeaker 3: Ja, ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Was sind die? Jedes Jahr zur WWDC verkündet Apple so, es gibt aus verschiedenen Kategorien Apps, die wir vorher nominiert haben und dann gibt es die Gewinner und da geht's eben darum, es geht unterschiedliche Kategorien und dort nutzen dann diese Apps im in der Regel halt irgendwo die technischen Innovationen des Apple Ökosystems bestmöglich aus. Das ist halt natürlich auch son bisschen auf die eigene Schulter klopfen. Guck mal, was wir alles können. Guck mal, was die Entwickler*innen da draußen alles mit unseren tollen Frameworks machen können und das schaukesen wir dann Mhm.\n\nUnd zeigen das. Und es gibt dieses Jahr 6 verschiedene Kategorien, die anfangen bei Delight and Fun.\n\nSpeaker 2: Das sind wir. Wir sind Delight and Fun.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und also, ne, sie sagen so was wie, bei Apple Technologies, ne. Also Du willst, wenn Du da gewinnen willst, musst Du schon so den maximalen Apple Weg, am besten keine Android App. Von Apple Watch bis alles, keine Ahnung was. Was weißt Du, das neueste, größte, letzte? Früher wusste ich das alles, ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Was denn? Was Größte?\n\nSpeaker 1: Irgendwas Cooles, was nur Apple irgendwie, wo sie sagen, wahrscheinlich hier so diesen Kamerabutton oder so wie es so.\n\nSpeaker 0: Alles. Ach so, Kamerabutton. Na ja, ich hatte jetzt grad so Vision OS ist auch immer noch son Thema Genau, ja, ja, genau,\n\nSpeaker 1: da wär ich da irgendwo reinkommen, aber so was wie das halt den Hardware Button da an der Seite jetzt ordentlich nutzt und da eine coole Experience aus diesem, weil es halt nur Ah,\n\nSpeaker 2: weil Du weil Du weil es ja auch so sensitiv ist und damit könntest Du ja auch 'n spielerisches Element machen, indem Du halt die Kamera unterdrück drückst und Ja, ja, okay.\n\nSpeaker 1: So. Und dann gibt es immer jetzt halt dann iOS, Vision OS und Mac OS. Ich weiß nicht, ob das immer so ist in iPad.\n\nSpeaker 2: Und wahrscheinlich auch Watch OS, iPad OS, TV OS. Genau. Die ganzen Sachen, oder?\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, ja. So. Und wenn es dann natürlich auf unterschiedlichen Plattformen geht, ist das natürlich auch noch mal cool. Grundsätzlich\n\nSpeaker 3: kann\n\nSpeaker 1: man schon sagen, da sind Apps, die sich halt also ne, die sich cool anfühlen. Von daher, die mal an zu ist immer son ganz guter, da will man mal coole Apps sehen, was so State of the Art, was App Design angeht.\n\nSpeaker 2: Nee oder\n\nSpeaker 1: was. Also kann man da mal rein.\n\nSpeaker 2: Nee, mal State of the Art, sondern ich hab 'n paar Reihen gesprochen. Ich find, die sind manchmal so einfach so einfach so einfach so cool, so irgendwie so, oh, das hatte ich bisher noch nicht erlebt in soner App. Ja. Und das war irgendwie cool, so einfach so, was was kann man denn theoretisch machen? Und ich also ich find schon sehr interessant.\n\nSpeaker 0: Da mal eine Lanze für Lotum und die Programmierbar zu brechen. 1 der Nominierten ist Ist die Programmier App. Nein. Ist aber ein, den Sven hier schon mal vorgestellt hat, als er zu Gast war und wir über Game Development und die Devcom und die Gamescom und so was alles gesprochen haben, da war das sein Pick. Und er hat schon irgendwie damals 'n coolen Pitch für das Spiel gemacht und offensichtlich hat Apple ihm zugehört und ihm deshalb Hat das gehört.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Natürlich. Wen ich wen\n\nSpeaker 1: ich wen hab ich gehört? Wen\n\nSpeaker 2: war's denn?\n\nSpeaker 0: Nein. Wunderbares Spiel übrigens. Hab ich mir auf Spenens Empfehlung auch damals direkt gekauft und gut investiertes Geld.\n\nSpeaker 1: Krass. Ja. Weil Du sagst, gekauft hast, ist dann auch sone Paid App, ne? Das ist halt auch so was. 9 Euro 99.\n\nGenau, halt nicht son nicht son jedes Gleiche wieder werbebasierte Ding und keine Ahnung Casual game, sondern son bisschen auf Also\n\nSpeaker 0: unsere Spiele kommen da nicht rein, wolltest Du jetzt sagen. Ja.\n\nSpeaker 1: Das ist richtig. Also ich bin ziemlich sicher, dass wir uns nicht besonders qualifizieren für die Apple Designer.\n\nSpeaker 2: Noch nicht. Growth Mindset, noch nicht.\n\nSpeaker 1: Also, pass auf. Wir machen spontan ein Gewinnspiel da draus. Wir haben die Kategorien. Mhm. Und da ist dann jeweils noch mal unterschieden nach Apps und Games in jeweils diesen Kategorien.\n\nDas heißt, am Ende wird es summar summarum 12 unterschiedliche Apps geben. Die gewinnen. Die gewinnen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ich korrigier jetzt grad noch mal das, was ich grade ankünd. Das ist ja schon ganz schön viel, 12 Apps. Ich wollte eigentlich sagen Ja,\n\nSpeaker 2: okay. Also\n\nSpeaker 1: wir machen\n\nSpeaker 2: da jetzt 'n Gewinnspiel. Kein Gewinnspiel. Doch,\n\nSpeaker 1: wir machen 'n Gewinnspiel raus. Jeder, der 10 von 12 der Finalisten vor der w w vor der vor der Veröffentlichung der Finalisten, nicht der Finalisten, der\n\nSpeaker 2: Sieger. Sieger.\n\nSpeaker 1: Der Gewinner uns schreibt an Programmier, an wo? An Gewinnspiel. Nein, an Podcast at Programmier Punkt Bar oder über eine Kontaktformular auf der Webseite und schreibt, wenn es funktioniert. Dann ist der oder diejenige in einem Lospott, ich kann nicht mehr reden, Lospott.\n\nSpeaker 2: Pott? Nein, Pott ist okay. Ich wir sind\n\nSpeaker 3: bei uns\n\nSpeaker 2: Podcast, deswegen.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und Jan, was kann man gewinnen am Ende?\n\nSpeaker 0: Ich war grade zu sehr abgelenkt mit, ich muss doch diese Gewinnspiel AGBs auf die Webseite bringen, die Du grade angekündigt hast, weil sonst heißen wir Richard den Kopf ab, wenn wir was verlosen, ohne dass irgendwie unseren hier zu covern vorher.\n\nSpeaker 1: Okay, komm.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ich glaub, das ist aber eine Liveshow. Es ist eine Liveshow. Also ich will, es kann dir sowas kann passieren. So was kann machen, 'n\n\nSpeaker 1: richtig dicken Gewinn raus und zwar ein Programmierconticket.\n\nSpeaker 2: What? Das ist alles krass. Inklusive Medien Greets.\n\nSpeaker 0: Programmierkonticket und Du musst was nur, damit ich's richtig verstanden hab und noch mal zusammenfasste. Du musst aus den 12 Kategorien, die's quasi gibt, 10 Richtige benennen, die dann am Ende auch quasi gewinnen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Weil das Und was, wenn's den Gleichstand gibt?\n\nSpeaker 1: Was, wenn's, das ist ja deswegen Los Pot.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ach ja, okay, Los Okay, Du musst 10 von 12 richtig haben\n\nSpeaker 3: und dann kommst Du\n\nSpeaker 2: Los Pot. Ja. Und wenn's nur 1 macht, dann entweder kriegt er's oder kriegt nichts. Ja. Okay, weil ist dann fifty fifty, okay.\n\nSpeaker 1: Genau. Und was ist die Programmiercon? Das ist unsere Konferenz, die dieses Jahr stattfindet am November, fünfundzwanzigsten, sechsundzwanzigsten November. Zweitägig. Zweitägig mit 2 Tracks und der reguläre Ticketpreis wird am Ende bei dreihundertundneun und für 90.\n\n49, was was sagt Jan?\n\nSpeaker 2: Jan, ich kann nicht Lippen lesen. Noch nicht. Noch nicht.\n\nSpeaker 1: Noch nicht. Dreineunundneunzig. 3 49. 3 49. 3 49.\n\n3 49. 3 49.\n\nSpeaker 3: 3 49. 3 49.\n\nSpeaker 1: 3 49. Ja. Finalpreis am Ende wird bei 349 Euro liegen. Das heißt, da ist was drin. Das ist\n\nSpeaker 2: voll das Krasse. Das ist voll das Krasse.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, ja. So, dann macht Jan kurz die AGW fertig.\n\nSpeaker 2: Das muss jetzt morgen fertig sein, Jan.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ja, ich\n\nSpeaker 3: weiß, was\n\nSpeaker 0: heut noch alles macht. Sonst muss ich\n\nSpeaker 2: alles innerhalb der letzten halben Stunde ergeben, das find ich schön.\n\nSpeaker 1: Ja, ich\n\nSpeaker 0: muss das hier\n\nSpeaker 3: WWWWWWWWWWWWWW\n\nSpeaker 0: Punkt com, wir machen hier das AGB, wünschen wir alles easy, das dafür sind wir ja da.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Aber aber Dennis, hast Du denn irgendwelche Favorites aus dieser Liste oder?\n\nSpeaker 1: Können wir noch was daraus machen, dass wenn der Gewinner dann zum gemeinsamen Gucken der WWDC herkommt, dann kriegt er noch eine Chipstide obendrauf. Oh.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und sein Ticket persönlich, können wir das dann auch so\n\nSpeaker 2: Das taucht wir auch. Dennis springt aus 'ner Torte raus.\n\nSpeaker 0: Ausm Plotter drücken und kriegt son großes Ticket dann in die Hand gedrückt. Ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Es muss überdimensional sein. Was ist was ist was ist groß größer als a 1? 0.\n\nSpeaker 1: A 0?\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Was ist größer als a 0? A minus 1? Gibt's es auch? Nein.\n\nOkay, das ist a 0 mal 4. So groß muss das sein.\n\nSpeaker 0: Dave ist 'n Developer, der nicht bis 0 zählt kann.\n\nSpeaker 1: Und was war das nämlich? Ein Zeitungsbogen.\n\nSpeaker 2: Früher. Ein Zeitungsbogen? Ja, ist a 0?\n\nSpeaker 1: Mhm.\n\nSpeaker 2: Krass.\n\nSpeaker 0: Wieder was gelernt in der Programmier war zum Schluss doch noch\n\nSpeaker 1: gefährliches Wissen. Ah ja.\n\nSpeaker 2: Wir lassen gut, mal\n\nSpeaker 1: zu verstehen. Ja, also\n\nSpeaker 2: 'n gutes Partywissen. Kann man auch mal raushauen, bis es jemand checkt und dann hieß er, ja, stimmt gar nicht. Und man\n\nSpeaker 1: Ich hab mal in 'nem Antiariat gearbeitet, gejobbt.\n\nSpeaker 0: Und das hat auch schon irgendwas mit Elon Musk zu tun. Aber das das sehen wir für eine andere Folge auch.\n\nSpeaker 2: Für unser Special mit Elon Musk. Ja.\n\nSpeaker 0: So. Wir verabschieden uns für heute.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ach so, okay, es gibt gar keine Nominierung von euch oder so oder was, was\n\nSpeaker 1: ihr Nein.\n\nSpeaker 2: Herausragen könnt. Ach okay, krass.\n\nSpeaker 1: Okay. Wir lassen ja jetzt Community.\n\nSpeaker 2: Cool. Ja, richtig. Cool, wenn es\n\nSpeaker 0: 'n Vorteile geben oder so.\n\nSpeaker 2: Ja. Was kriege ich, wenn\n\nSpeaker 1: ich 10 von 12 ruhig hab?\n\nSpeaker 2: 'N Kurs von denen\n\nSpeaker 0: Darfst Du auch auf die Programmierkunden kommen?\n\nSpeaker 1: Okay.\n\nSpeaker 2: Mit mit mir. Mit Dave, ja. Sehr gut, wir sperren uns in dein Kämmerchen.\n\nSpeaker 1: Alright. Gut, aber Bis\n\nSpeaker 0: zum Ende 3 Woche. 2. 1. 1. Und tschüs.\n\nTschüs.",[24712,24721,24728,24734,24738,24743,24750,24754,24759,24763,24773,24779,24783,24788,24799,24803,24807,24816,24823,24829,24836,24840,24853,24857,24864,24873,24886,24897,24901,24911,24918,24925,24930,24934,24938,24945,24957,24963,24970,24974,24977,24987,25000,25006,25015,25021,25027,25033,25039,25046,25050,25061,25065,25070,25076,25080,25084,25089,25093,25106,25118,25126,25130,25142,25147,25151,25154,25157,25170,25183,25188,25192,25204,25217,25230,25242,25254,25267,25276,25280,25287,25291,25296,25300,25305,25309,25313,25317,25330,25343,25356,25369,25382,25395,25408,25418,25422,25426,25430,25435,25439,25443,25456,25469,25473,25486,25497,25506,25509,25516,25529,25540,25543,25550,25560,25567,25580,25584,25588,25592,25599,25611,25615,25621,25626,25638,25651,25663,25674,25678,25682,25693,25699,25703,25711,25716,25728,25740,25747,25751,25755,25766,25778,25791,25795,25808,25818,25830,25843,25846,25856,25860,25871,25874,25886,25899,25912,25916,25920,25924,25928,25938,25951,25963,25976,25985,25996,26000,26012,26015,26019,26031,26036,26040,26045,26049,26053,26057,26069,26073,26077,26087,26091,26095,26099,26108,26114,26125,26132,26136,26149,26155,26163,26167,26172,26176,26189,26200,26206,26210,26217,26229,26233,26237,26241,26248,26252,26257,26264,26274,26278,26282,26294,26300,26306,26318,26324,26328,26335,26340,26344,26351,26358,26365,26368,26374,26378,26383,26395,26407,26413,26418,26422,26429,26439,26443,26448,26454,26460,26471,26478,26481,26489,26493,26497,26504,26511,26515,26525,26532,26536,26540,26544,26548,26552,26562,26566,26573,26579,26584,26588,26592,26596,26606,26617,26621,26627,26635,26639,26643,26653,26659,26664,26668,26672,26676,26682,26686,26689,26693,26696,26700,26705,26710,26714,26720,26725,26732,26736,26746,26752,26756,26762,26769,26772,26775,26779,26785,26789,26795,26803,26807,26813,26818,26823,26827,26831,26837,26842,26848,26852,26857,26861,26865,26869,26872,26880,26885,26894],{"sentences":24713,"speaker":125,"num_words":24720,"start":123,"end":289},[24714,24716,24718],{"text":24715,"start":123,"end":172},"Hallo und herzlich willkommen zu den Programmierball News heute in Kalenderwoche 22.",{"text":24717,"start":177,"end":203},"Hab ich natürlich gewusst und bin vollkommen vorbereitet.",{"text":24719,"start":207,"end":289},"Ich bin der, ich muss das jetzt hier wieder richtig sagen, Jan Gregor Engetriebel wurde mir gesagt und mit mir im Studio sitzen,",43,{"sentences":24722,"speaker":105,"num_words":24727,"start":294,"end":319},[24723,24725],{"text":24724,"start":294,"end":301},"Dennis Becker.",{"text":24726,"start":306,"end":319},"Oh, das ist für",6,{"sentences":24729,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":319,"end":351},[24730,24732],{"text":24731,"start":319,"end":335},"einfach ganz toll.",{"text":24733,"start":340,"end":351},"Komplett backert, Alter.",{"sentences":24735,"speaker":125,"num_words":456,"start":351,"end":365},[24736],{"text":24737,"start":351,"end":365},"Aber ich dachte,",{"sentences":24739,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":365,"end":384},[24740],{"text":24741,"start":365,"end":384},"d ist voll weit vorne.",5,{"sentences":24744,"speaker":325,"num_words":24749,"start":384,"end":450},[24745,24747],{"text":24746,"start":384,"end":439},"Ja, aber d, genau d ist voll weit vorne, aber d a ist näher als d e.",{"text":24748,"start":439,"end":450},"Ja, das ist",20,{"sentences":24751,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":450,"end":461},[24752],{"text":24753,"start":450,"end":461},"nicht, dass",{"sentences":24755,"speaker":325,"num_words":24758,"start":461,"end":477},[24756],{"text":24757,"start":461,"end":477},"ich der Obst war",4,{"sentences":24760,"speaker":105,"num_words":24758,"start":477,"end":490},[24761],{"text":24762,"start":477,"end":490},"und nicht vorher vorher.",{"sentences":24764,"speaker":325,"num_words":24772,"start":490,"end":588},[24765,24767,24769,24770],{"text":24766,"start":490,"end":506},"Stimmt, das ist crazy.",{"text":24768,"start":506,"end":540},"Also warte mal, wer ist sie, Dennis Becker?",{"text":24724,"start":543,"end":547},{"text":24771,"start":550,"end":588},"Und auch noch Dave Acker, Dave Krusitzky Acker, der sommerliche Boy.",25,{"sentences":24774,"speaker":125,"num_words":24778,"start":593,"end":654},[24775,24776],{"text":597,"start":593,"end":594},{"text":24777,"start":599,"end":654},"Mal kurz festhalten, dass wenn ich einmal richtiges Intro mach, ihr es verkackt habt, so,",16,{"sentences":24780,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":654,"end":664},[24781,24782],{"text":662,"start":654,"end":659},{"text":665,"start":659,"end":664},{"sentences":24784,"speaker":105,"num_words":24787,"start":664,"end":710},[24785],{"text":24786,"start":664,"end":710},"Ja, aber das liegt auch daran, dass Du's dir erst mal richtig gemacht hast.",14,{"sentences":24789,"speaker":125,"num_words":24798,"start":710,"end":899},[24790,24792,24794,24796],{"text":24791,"start":710,"end":733},"Das hab ich mich drauf eingestellt.",{"text":24793,"start":737,"end":751},"Vollkommen ausm Konzept gebracht.",{"text":24795,"start":756,"end":800},"Außer Intros wollen wir heute besprechen, was es bei Bun Neues gibt.",{"text":24797,"start":803,"end":899},"Wir rannten ein bisschen über AI und Dennis hat zu guter Letzt noch die Apple Design Awards dabei, beziehungsweise ich glaub, die Finalisten erst oder so was, gell?",50,{"sentences":24800,"speaker":105,"num_words":456,"start":899,"end":912},[24801],{"text":24802,"start":899,"end":912},"Die Finalisten, ja.",{"sentences":24804,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":912,"end":920},[24805],{"text":24806,"start":912,"end":920},"Die Finalisten.",{"sentences":24808,"speaker":105,"num_words":24815,"start":920,"end":995},[24809,24811,24812,24814],{"text":24810,"start":920,"end":961},"Denn die WWDC kommt ja erst am Irgendwo, September oder?",{"text":968,"start":961,"end":966},{"text":24813,"start":971,"end":990},"Achtter oder zehnter Juni oder so was.",{"text":997,"start":990,"end":995},19,{"sentences":24817,"speaker":125,"num_words":24822,"start":995,"end":1041},[24818,24820],{"text":24819,"start":995,"end":1008},"Speaking of WWDC.",{"text":24821,"start":1012,"end":1041},"Dennis, Du hast da News dazu, hab ich gehört.",12,{"sentences":24824,"speaker":105,"num_words":24727,"start":1046,"end":1067},[24825,24826,24828],{"text":1050,"start":1046,"end":1047},{"text":24827,"start":1047,"end":1062},"Haben wir uns entschieden?",{"text":1069,"start":1066,"end":1067},{"sentences":24830,"speaker":125,"num_words":24835,"start":1067,"end":1105},[24831,24833],{"text":24832,"start":1067,"end":1076},"Oh, wirklich.",{"text":24834,"start":1076,"end":1105},"Du kannst das jetzt quasi live on air entscheiden.",11,{"sentences":24837,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":1105,"end":1113},[24838],{"text":24839,"start":1105,"end":1113},"Du kannst",{"sentences":24841,"speaker":105,"num_words":24852,"start":1113,"end":1306},[24842,24844,24846,24848,24850],{"text":24843,"start":1113,"end":1121},"das live entscheiden.",{"text":24845,"start":1123,"end":1193},"Ja, wir hatten das, ich glaub, vorletztes Jahr, ich bin mir gar nicht sicher, ob wir das letztes Jahr auch angeboten haben.",{"text":24847,"start":1193,"end":1202},"Nee, nee.",{"text":24849,"start":1202,"end":1221},"Da meinte er nicht, nee.",{"text":24851,"start":1224,"end":1306},"Wir haben ja sone Tradition, dass wir die WWWDC Keynote gar nicht jetzt gemeinsam gucken und danach eine Podcastfolge darauf aufnehmen und dazu aufnehmen und uns Hast",59,{"sentences":24854,"speaker":325,"num_words":24742,"start":1306,"end":1324},[24855],{"text":24856,"start":1306,"end":1324},"Du gesagt, dass wir sie",{"sentences":24858,"speaker":105,"num_words":24863,"start":1324,"end":1345},[24859,24861],{"text":24860,"start":1324,"end":1332},"nicht gemeinsam gucken?",{"text":24862,"start":1332,"end":1345},"Nein, wir gucken sie.",7,{"sentences":24865,"speaker":325,"num_words":24872,"start":1345,"end":1410},[24866,24868,24870],{"text":24867,"start":1345,"end":1362},"Ah, wir gucken sie gemeinsam.",{"text":24869,"start":1362,"end":1401},"Ich sag, also das Tradition ist, wie sie nicht gemeinsam gucken.",{"text":24871,"start":1401,"end":1410},"Okay, ja.",18,{"sentences":24874,"speaker":105,"num_words":24885,"start":1413,"end":1769},[24875,24877,24879,24881,24883],{"text":24876,"start":1413,"end":1498},"Und vor 2 Jahren haben wir dazu auf eingeladen, andere Programmierhörer*innen da draußen oder Programmierbar Fans einfach, dass die dazukommen können und mittels gucken können.",{"text":24878,"start":1498,"end":1521},"Und das machen wir dieses Jahr jetzt einfach wieder.",{"text":24880,"start":1525,"end":1623},"Wir bestellen ein bisschen Essen, je nachdem, wie viele Leute da sind, gibt's 'n bisschen was zu snacken, Getränke haben wir sowieso immer hier und dann gucken wir das ganze Ding danach.",{"text":24882,"start":1623,"end":1719},"Machen wir noch schnell eine Live Podcast Folge und nehmen nehmen It's a Rap in knapper Stunde zusammengefasst, was 2 Stunden Präsentationen bei uns hätten auch zeigen können.",{"text":24884,"start":1719,"end":1769},"Also ich gebe jetzt an ab an Jan, der euch sagt, ihr könnt euch anmelden über Okay.",111,{"sentences":24887,"speaker":125,"num_words":24896,"start":1774,"end":1918},[24888,24890,24892,24894],{"text":24889,"start":1774,"end":1825},"Bis ihr die Folge hört, haben wir das bestimmt auf Meetup Punkt com eingestellt, achter Juni.",{"text":24891,"start":1825,"end":1849},"Ich hab grad noch mal nachgeschaut, das sicherzustellen.",{"text":24893,"start":1853,"end":1864},"Da findet das statt.",{"text":24895,"start":1868,"end":1918},"Und ich glaube, ich hab jetzt nicht die Zeitzone im Kopf, aber es müsste 7 Uhr Nein,",45,{"sentences":24898,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":1918,"end":1924},[24899],{"text":24900,"start":1918,"end":1924},"7 Uhr.",{"sentences":24902,"speaker":125,"num_words":24910,"start":1928,"end":2080},[24903,24905,24906,24908],{"text":24904,"start":1928,"end":1934},"Wieder, genau.",{"text":665,"start":1938,"end":1939},{"text":24907,"start":1939,"end":1995},"Und dann fangen wir vielleicht wie gewohnt bei uns bei dem Meet Up so 6 oder so was an.",{"text":24909,"start":1999,"end":2080},"Da mach ich ein bisschen hier die Schöne auf und dann schauen wir mal, was es so Neues gibt und über welche AI Fehltritte wir dieses Jahr lästern können oder so was.",54,{"sentences":24912,"speaker":325,"num_words":24917,"start":2083,"end":2142},[24913,24915],{"text":24914,"start":2083,"end":2114},"Ich fand's sehr geil, dass es wirklich grade spontan entstanden ist.",{"text":24916,"start":2114,"end":2142},"So diese Entscheidung, die grade spontan gefällt wurde, dann jetzt",21,{"sentences":24919,"speaker":125,"num_words":24924,"start":2142,"end":2176},[24920,24922],{"text":24921,"start":2142,"end":2153},"auch direkt von Jan.",{"text":24923,"start":2153,"end":2176},"Sehr, ja, das ist mir Geil.",10,{"sentences":24926,"speaker":325,"num_words":24758,"start":2180,"end":2193},[24927,24928],{"text":2178,"start":2180,"end":2181},{"text":24929,"start":2181,"end":2193},"Hat es doch",{"sentences":24931,"speaker":125,"num_words":24872,"start":2197,"end":2242},[24932],{"text":24933,"start":2197,"end":2242},"tagelang darüber gefühlt geschrieben und jeder war so, ja, machen wir das jetzt oder machen wir das jetzt?",{"sentences":24935,"speaker":325,"num_words":456,"start":2242,"end":2253},[24936],{"text":24937,"start":2242,"end":2253},"Und dann hat",{"sentences":24939,"speaker":125,"num_words":24815,"start":2253,"end":2319},[24940,24942,24944],{"text":24941,"start":2253,"end":2295},"er gesagt, okay, wir müssen uns Hat einfach heute entscheiden und dann Experiment.",{"text":24943,"start":2299,"end":2314},"Ja, nee, nee, einfach so.",{"text":2322,"start":2314,"end":2319},{"sentences":24946,"speaker":325,"num_words":24956,"start":2319,"end":2449},[24947,24949,24951,24953,24955],{"text":24948,"start":2319,"end":2328},"ich gut.",{"text":24950,"start":2328,"end":2404},"Das Ding ist, also wir sind nicht mal 'n Live Podcast, also wir können ja jetzt alles noch rausschneiden und so, aber wir machen das einfach so, als wär's live.",{"text":24952,"start":2408,"end":2417},"Das ist krass.",{"text":24954,"start":2417,"end":2444},"Ich glaub, wir haben wirklich noch nicht erschrocken.",{"text":665,"start":2448,"end":2449},44,{"sentences":24958,"speaker":105,"num_words":24835,"start":2449,"end":2486},[24959,24961],{"text":24960,"start":2449,"end":2479},"So verkacktes Intro könnte man noch mal neu machen.",{"text":24962,"start":2479,"end":2486},"Aber nein.",{"sentences":24964,"speaker":325,"num_words":24969,"start":2486,"end":2510},[24965,24967],{"text":24966,"start":2486,"end":2499},"Wir haben nur den Intro.",{"text":24968,"start":2502,"end":2510},"Sind wir nämlich.",8,{"sentences":24971,"speaker":125,"num_words":24924,"start":2514,"end":2546},[24972],{"text":24973,"start":2514,"end":2546},"Die ungeschminkte Wahrheit gibt's nämlich bei der Programi war immer.",{"sentences":24975,"speaker":325,"num_words":105,"start":2549,"end":2550},[24976],{"text":665,"start":2549,"end":2550},{"sentences":24978,"speaker":125,"num_words":24986,"start":2554,"end":2644},[24979,24980,24982,24984],{"text":1771,"start":2554,"end":2555},{"text":24981,"start":2559,"end":2578},"AI News, die wir gemeinsam uns anschauen.",{"text":24983,"start":2578,"end":2627},"Wie, Dennis, wie macht ihr das eigentlich nächste Woche, wenn ihr wenn wir alle nicht hier sind?",{"text":24985,"start":2627,"end":2644},"Macht ihr dann trotzdem AI News?",31,{"sentences":24988,"speaker":105,"num_words":24999,"start":2648,"end":2803},[24989,24991,24993,24995,24997],{"text":24990,"start":2648,"end":2662},"Schön, dass Du's live ansprichst.",{"text":24992,"start":2666,"end":2681},"Ich weiß es ehrlich gesagt nicht.",{"text":24994,"start":2681,"end":2749},"Also tatsächlich Lotum hat den Luxus, wir sind wieder auf unserem jährlichen Lotum Wochenende und sind 4 Tage in Portugal und Portugal?",{"text":24996,"start":2753,"end":2786},"In die Veröffentlichungszeitraum und auch in den Aufnahmeseite der normalen AI News.",{"text":24998,"start":2786,"end":2803},"Warte, meine Aufnahmen kriegt",49,{"sentences":25001,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":2803,"end":2828},[25002,25004],{"text":25003,"start":2803,"end":2819},"man wahrscheinlich hinter Dienstag.",{"text":25005,"start":2819,"end":2828},"Dienstag kann",{"sentences":25007,"speaker":105,"num_words":25014,"start":2828,"end":2905},[25008,25010,25012],{"text":25009,"start":2828,"end":2838},"man noch hinkriegen.",{"text":25011,"start":2838,"end":2853},"Also Aufnahme ist eigentlich okay.",{"text":25013,"start":2857,"end":2905},"Jetzt musst Du sagen gern, ob Du Bock hast auf das öffentlichem Video hochladen, wenn wir",24,{"sentences":25016,"speaker":325,"num_words":24969,"start":2905,"end":2931},[25017,25019],{"text":25018,"start":2905,"end":2918},"auch alles live hier.",{"text":25020,"start":2918,"end":2931},"Es ist alles geil.",{"sentences":25022,"speaker":125,"num_words":24778,"start":2931,"end":2987},[25023,25025],{"text":25024,"start":2931,"end":2978},"Ich hab schon andere Podcasts vom Flughafen veröffentlicht, dass daran soll's nicht scheitern.",{"text":25026,"start":2978,"end":2987},"Wir machen Okay.",{"sentences":25028,"speaker":105,"num_words":25032,"start":2987,"end":3049},[25029,25031],{"text":25030,"start":2987,"end":3044},"Also komm, lass uns das weitermachen, sonst wir haben doch total son totalen Streak seit ever.",{"text":3051,"start":3048,"end":3049},17,{"sentences":25034,"speaker":325,"num_words":24758,"start":3053,"end":3070},[25035,25037,25038],{"text":25036,"start":3053,"end":3059},"Seit Jahren.",{"text":3066,"start":3063,"end":3064},{"text":3072,"start":3069,"end":3070},{"sentences":25040,"speaker":105,"num_words":24863,"start":3070,"end":3098},[25041,25043,25044],{"text":25042,"start":3070,"end":3084},"War nix, ja.",{"text":3089,"start":3084,"end":3087},{"text":25045,"start":3087,"end":3098},"Nix mal auf.",{"sentences":25047,"speaker":325,"num_words":24835,"start":3102,"end":3132},[25048],{"text":25049,"start":3102,"end":3132},"Jetzt aber ich würde ich weiß gar nicht genau, ob ich",{"sentences":25051,"speaker":105,"num_words":25060,"start":3132,"end":3502},[25052,25054,25056,25058],{"text":25053,"start":3132,"end":3183},"so ganz explizit gefragt habe, die Hörer*innen da draußen oder ob das einfach nur unser Gedankenspiel war.",{"text":25055,"start":3183,"end":3283},"Wir überlegen ja, wie wir mit diesen beiden News Formaten weitermachen, weil wir hier auch immer viel über AI reden und ob's überhaupt noch Sinn macht, das Ganze zu trennen oder ob ihr das irgendwie zusammenbringen sollen.",{"text":25057,"start":3283,"end":3442},"Also falls ihr da irgend einen Take zu habt, wollt ihr das gerne getrennt haben oder findet ihr's gut, wenn einfach die AI Themen, die jetzt nicht nur mehr Modelupdates sind, sondern vor allen Dingen Produkt und wie sind Prozesseoren, keine Ahnung, was solche Dinge, einfach auch in den normalen News besprochen werden.",{"text":25059,"start":3442,"end":3502},"Und dann möchtet ihr es gerne als getrennte Formate haben, dann schreibt uns gerne an Podcast der Programmierpunkt bar.",126,{"sentences":25062,"speaker":325,"num_words":456,"start":3506,"end":3513},[25063],{"text":25064,"start":3506,"end":3513},"So ist es.",{"sentences":25066,"speaker":125,"num_words":24720,"start":3517,"end":3626},[25067,25069],{"text":25068,"start":3517,"end":3622},"Und weil wir, wie Dennis schon angefließt hat, auch in diesen Folgen immer nur über AI Themen sprechen, macht Dave direkt den Anfang und erzählt uns mal, was das bei Bun alles Neues gibt und was das mit AI zu tun hat.",{"text":665,"start":3622,"end":3626},{"sentences":25071,"speaker":105,"num_words":24787,"start":3626,"end":3676},[25072,25074],{"text":25073,"start":3626,"end":3656},"Ja und andererseits Bun ist ja unser unser Steckenwert.",{"text":25075,"start":3656,"end":3676},"Unser Herzensthema seit vielen Jahren.",{"sentences":25077,"speaker":125,"num_words":325,"start":3678,"end":3682},[25078],{"text":25079,"start":3678,"end":3682},"Also genau",{"sentences":25081,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":3682,"end":3689},[25082],{"text":25083,"start":3682,"end":3689},"gelungen ist",{"sentences":25085,"speaker":325,"num_words":456,"start":3689,"end":3701},[25086,25087],{"text":3694,"start":3689,"end":3691},{"text":25088,"start":3691,"end":3701},"Sebi ist",{"sentences":25090,"speaker":456,"num_words":456,"start":3701,"end":3711},[25091],{"text":25092,"start":3701,"end":3711},"jetzt das Thema.",{"sentences":25094,"speaker":325,"num_words":25105,"start":3711,"end":3894},[25095,25097,25099,25101,25103],{"text":25096,"start":3711,"end":3743},"Ich wollt sagen, weiß ich nicht, das find ich so schön.",{"text":25098,"start":3743,"end":3778},"Immer wenn's Band geht, muss jemand direkt an Sebi denken.",{"text":25100,"start":3778,"end":3827},"Und das fühlt sich immer so an, als würd Sebi grad neben mir sitzen und mich streicheln.",{"text":25102,"start":3827,"end":3876},"So, bisschen zu nah, die Lobmaschine hoch, aber jeden Fall, ich spür Sebi grade.",{"text":25104,"start":3881,"end":3894},"Sebi spürt dich bestimmt auch grade.",58,{"sentences":25107,"speaker":325,"num_words":25117,"start":3897,"end":3998},[25108,25110,25112,25113,25115],{"text":25109,"start":3897,"end":3908},"Genau, es geht Bun.",{"text":25111,"start":3908,"end":3926},"Es geht gar nicht erst mal AI.",{"text":665,"start":3926,"end":3930},{"text":25114,"start":3930,"end":3971},"Denn Jared Sumner, der Schöpfer von Bun, hat jetzt ein PR Gemerged.",{"text":25116,"start":3975,"end":3998},"So weit, so unspannend erst mal, denkt man sich.",33,{"sentences":25119,"speaker":325,"num_words":25014,"start":4001,"end":4071},[25120,25122,25124],{"text":25121,"start":4001,"end":4022},"Der Titel war aber schon sehr, sehr crazy.",{"text":25123,"start":4025,"end":4046},"Titel war, also schon mal irgendwie schon krass.",{"text":25125,"start":4046,"end":4071},"Wer's nicht wusste, vorher war's in Sig geschrieben.",{"sentences":25127,"speaker":105,"num_words":24758,"start":4075,"end":4087},[25128],{"text":25129,"start":4075,"end":4087},"Einsatz, was Bun ist?",{"sentences":25131,"speaker":325,"num_words":25141,"start":4087,"end":4249},[25132,25133,25135,25137,25139],{"text":3910,"start":4087,"end":4091},{"text":25134,"start":4095,"end":4125},"Es ist für alles, was mit Java zu tun hat relevant.",{"text":25136,"start":4129,"end":4170},"Also quasi man kennt ja Node und das ist einfach der komplette Tag von Node.",{"text":25138,"start":4173,"end":4198},"Und wenn Du Java sagst, meinst Du, ja?",{"text":25140,"start":4202,"end":4249},"Alter, das ist eher, ich bin wahrscheinlich immer nicht der Erste, dem was passiert ist, ja.",51,{"sentences":25143,"speaker":325,"num_words":24917,"start":4252,"end":4319},[25144,25145],{"text":4254,"start":4252,"end":4253},{"text":25146,"start":4256,"end":4319},"Genau und genau, es war vorher in Sick geschrieben, kennt niemand und eigentlich Banden war so das größte Steckenpferd Ballerfinder,",{"sentences":25148,"speaker":105,"num_words":24727,"start":4323,"end":4335},[25149],{"text":25150,"start":4323,"end":4335},"die das in Sick geschrieben haben.",{"sentences":25152,"speaker":325,"num_words":105,"start":4335,"end":4338},[25153],{"text":4341,"start":4335,"end":4338},{"sentences":25155,"speaker":105,"num_words":105,"start":4344,"end":4345},[25156],{"text":4347,"start":4344,"end":4345},{"sentences":25158,"speaker":325,"num_words":25169,"start":4345,"end":4639},[25159,25161,25163,25165,25167],{"text":25160,"start":4345,"end":4458},"Und es und es und das krasse ist aber jetzt, wenn man sich diese Dimension anschaut einfach von von von diesem PR, denn fast 2200 Filze wurden gechange und insgesamt 1000000 Zeilen Code wurden hinzugefügt.",{"text":25162,"start":4461,"end":4511},"Es ist schon, also crazy natürlich, wenn man das hört, so ja okay, alles einfach rein und zack, merged.",{"text":25164,"start":4514,"end":4562},"Jared selbst gibt da einige Vorteile an, hat gesagt, hey, ist runtergegangen 3 bis 8 Megabyte.",{"text":25166,"start":4562,"end":4589},"Also da hat sich's schon mal 'n bisschen dafür gelohnt.",{"text":25168,"start":4589,"end":4639},"Die haben zahlreiche Benchmarks auch gemacht, die neutral sind bis schneller so, was schon mal irgendwie ganz cool ist.",99,{"sentences":25171,"speaker":325,"num_words":25182,"start":4639,"end":4908},[25172,25174,25176,25178,25180],{"text":25173,"start":4639,"end":4755},"Und größter Vorteil, den Sie genannt haben, ist, dass die jetzt für die Entwicklung von Banden so Tools haben, wodurch paar Memory Leaks behoben wurden direkt und in Zukunft halt natürlich diese verhindert werden, da das Deloping einfacher ist.",{"text":25175,"start":4755,"end":4796},"Hat damals sehr, sehr viel Zeit gekostet und wird jetzt halt quasi deutlich schneller gehen einfach.",{"text":25177,"start":4799,"end":4839},"Wer will, kann das Ganze auch schon ausprobieren mit Bun Upgrade minus minus Kanary.",{"text":25179,"start":4843,"end":4868},"Kann man das Ganze jetzt schon mit mit Rust testen.",{"text":25181,"start":4868,"end":4908},"Aber ist ja jetzt die Frage so, was ist doch da nicht so spannend?",93,{"sentences":25184,"speaker":325,"num_words":24822,"start":4908,"end":4948},[25185,25186],{"text":665,"start":4908,"end":4912},{"text":25187,"start":4915,"end":4948},"Also natürlich sieht man sich Dimension, 1000000 Signcall ist crazy so.",{"sentences":25189,"speaker":105,"num_words":325,"start":4951,"end":4957},[25190],{"text":25191,"start":4951,"end":4957},"Meine kleiner.",{"sentences":25193,"speaker":325,"num_words":25203,"start":4957,"end":5264},[25194,25196,25197,25199,25201],{"text":25195,"start":4957,"end":4991},"Ist weißt ohne meine kleine Ecke, ist schon krass.",{"text":4254,"start":4993,"end":4994},{"text":25198,"start":4997,"end":5082},"Aber das Spannende daran ist und das ist natürlich grade für so ein AI Fanatiker, wie Dallas es ist, also krass, denn das das alles wurde mit AI neu geschrieben, komplett.",{"text":25200,"start":5086,"end":5227},"Das also was ja schon mal an sich krass ist, ne, weil natürlich son von SIG zu Rust hätte wahrscheinlich vorher irgendwie mehrere Wochen, wenn nicht sogar Monate Zeit in Anspruch genommen, mehrere Entwickler, die da dran sind, das alles natürlich ausgiebig testen, was jetzt wahrscheinlich auch passiert ist, muss man sagen.",{"text":25202,"start":5230,"end":5264},"Aber jetzt wurd es einfach in paar Tagen mit der RR runtergerattert.",105,{"sentences":25205,"speaker":325,"num_words":25216,"start":5264,"end":5597},[25206,25208,25210,25212,25214],{"text":25207,"start":5264,"end":5404},"Also ich glaub, das war unter eine Woche und dann hat er es einfach reingemerged, aber und das ist jetzt, wo mich dann eure Meinung gleich auch noch mal interessieren wird, aber auch natürlich muss man sagen, in der gesamten Community war es ein sehr, sehr kontroverses Thema, wenn nicht sogar polarisierend.",{"text":25209,"start":5408,"end":5463},"Also es war wirklich krass, wenn man so diesen PR gesehen hat so, also waren 1600 Daumen hoch, genauso viele Daumen runter.",{"text":25211,"start":5463,"end":5500},"Es gab viele Herzen, auch viele lachende Smileys, viele traurige Smileys und so.",{"text":25213,"start":5500,"end":5561},"Und wenn man jetzt irgendwie Twitter, Reddit, Hacker News et cetera sich irgendwie anschaut, das ist also schon sehr, sehr heiß diskutiert.",{"text":25215,"start":5564,"end":5597},"Natürlich also zum einen, weil's komplett mit BI gemacht wurde, ne.",120,{"sentences":25218,"speaker":325,"num_words":25229,"start":5597,"end":5791},[25219,25221,25223,25225,25227],{"text":25220,"start":5597,"end":5676},"Also das wird irgendwie so 'n ganzer so irgendwie, was schon irgendwie krass Aber natürlich auch sone Frage war, die aufgetaucht hat so, warum jetzt einmal der in Rust, ne?",{"text":25222,"start":5676,"end":5695},"Das ist ja auch irgendwie sone berechtigte Frage.",{"text":25224,"start":5695,"end":5727},"Man hat sich damals Physik entschieden, gab's wahrscheinlich auch Gründe für.",{"text":25226,"start":5730,"end":5736},"Jetzt der ganze.",{"text":25228,"start":5740,"end":5791},"Und tatsächlich haben sich da so 2 Lager gebildet, wo ich ehrlicherweise sagen muss, ich kann auch beide Seiten verstehen.",72,{"sentences":25231,"speaker":325,"num_words":24956,"start":5795,"end":5916},[25232,25234,25236,25238,25240],{"text":25233,"start":5795,"end":5820},"Offiziell gibt es halt so 3 Gründe, warum das jetzt gemacht wurde.",{"text":25235,"start":5820,"end":5836},"Das eine ist halt Ökosystem und.",{"text":25237,"start":5841,"end":5854},"Sieg ist halt wahnsinnig jung.",{"text":25239,"start":5854,"end":5889},"Ich glaub, die Sprache existiert vielleicht 10 Jahre, wenn nicht so weniger.",{"text":25241,"start":5893,"end":5916},"Und eigentlich das gesamte Bunte musste alles neu schreiben.",{"sentences":25243,"speaker":325,"num_words":24852,"start":5916,"end":6085},[25244,25246,25248,25250,25252],{"text":25245,"start":5916,"end":5959},"Also egal, was sie brauchten, so die mussten das halt in Sigg erst mal selbst schreiben.",{"text":25247,"start":5959,"end":6002},"Und natürlich Rust gibt's schon seit Ewigkeiten, hat 'n superkrasses Ökosystem, konnten das megageil nutzen.",{"text":25249,"start":6005,"end":6020},"Punkt 2 ist Sicherheit und Memoryleaks.",{"text":25251,"start":6025,"end":6056},"So SIG ist halt son bisschen ein bisschen niceres c oder so.",{"text":25253,"start":6056,"end":6085},"Was heißt niceres c, aber auf jeden Fall sehr zehnar.",{"sentences":25255,"speaker":325,"num_words":25266,"start":6085,"end":6245},[25256,25258,25260,25262,25264],{"text":25257,"start":6085,"end":6121},"Das heißt, man muss sich halt Speicherallokation und so was halt selbst kümmern.",{"text":25259,"start":6124,"end":6140},"Das übernimmt halt Russ selbst mit diesem.",{"text":25261,"start":6143,"end":6163},"Wer's noch nicht kennt, kannst Du mal nachschauen.",{"text":25263,"start":6167,"end":6214},"Ist da halt dafür da, dass er halt das automatisch alles prüft, so, dass da keine Memoryleaks entstehen.",{"text":25265,"start":6217,"end":6245},"Und natürlich, Punkt 3, was ich auch nachvollziehen kann, das Entwicklerökosystem.",57,{"sentences":25268,"speaker":325,"num_words":25275,"start":6249,"end":6385},[25269,25271,25273],{"text":25270,"start":6249,"end":6306},"Weil wenn die natürlich irgendwie Teamunterstützung brauchen und sagen so, hey, wir suchen richtig gute SIG Entwickler so, gibt's halt keine so.",{"text":25272,"start":6306,"end":6366},"Rust Entwickler gibt's natürlich wie Sand am Meer gefühlt und dass das durchaus auch 'n Grund war, offizielle Seite vom Bann.",{"text":25274,"start":6366,"end":6385},"Aber kurzer Factcheck, Factcheck, die",48,{"sentences":25277,"speaker":105,"num_words":24835,"start":6388,"end":6422},[25278],{"text":25279,"start":6388,"end":6422},"Fake Programmiersprache Rust gibt es seit 2016, also seit 11 Jahren.",{"sentences":25281,"speaker":325,"num_words":24969,"start":6424,"end":6450},[25282,25283,25285],{"text":6427,"start":6424,"end":6425},{"text":25284,"start":6430,"end":6441},"Bist Du dir sicher?",{"text":25286,"start":6441,"end":6450},"Rust oder Sik?",{"sentences":25288,"speaker":105,"num_words":24924,"start":6455,"end":6485},[25289],{"text":25290,"start":6455,"end":6485},"Davor wurde es schon bei Monzilla 5 Jahre lang entwickelt.",{"sentences":25292,"speaker":325,"num_words":25295,"start":6488,"end":6509},[25293],{"text":25294,"start":6488,"end":6509},"Ja, es ist Aber es ist jetzt ja noch",9,{"sentences":25297,"speaker":105,"num_words":24787,"start":6509,"end":6548},[25298],{"text":25299,"start":6509,"end":6548},"nicht so, weil Du hast gesagt, es ist Ewigkeit und uralt und keiner Ja,",{"sentences":25301,"speaker":125,"num_words":25304,"start":6548,"end":6587},[25302],{"text":25303,"start":6548,"end":6587},"aber der Dave ist 'n junger Kerl, von dem ich Für mich sind",13,{"sentences":25306,"speaker":325,"num_words":24863,"start":6590,"end":6612},[25307],{"text":25308,"start":6590,"end":6612},"2 Jahre die Hälfte meiner Lebens sein.",{"sentences":25310,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":6615,"end":6620},[25311],{"text":25312,"start":6615,"end":6620},"Hab ich",{"sentences":25314,"speaker":105,"num_words":24727,"start":6620,"end":6634},[25315],{"text":25316,"start":6620,"end":6634},"gesagt, den gibt's seit 10 Jahren.",{"sentences":25318,"speaker":325,"num_words":25329,"start":6637,"end":6752},[25319,25321,25323,25325,25327],{"text":25320,"start":6637,"end":6670},"Ja, okay, das ist das ist jetzt nicht so großer Unterschied.",{"text":25322,"start":6673,"end":6715},"Genau, aber die sind aber die sind ja keine großen Playerhändler, ne, muss man ja aussagen.",{"text":25324,"start":6715,"end":6722},"Ja, richtig.",{"text":25326,"start":6722,"end":6729},"So, richtig.",{"text":25328,"start":6732,"end":6752},"Genau und also so viel das offizielle Statement.",39,{"sentences":25331,"speaker":325,"num_words":25342,"start":6752,"end":7012},[25332,25334,25336,25338,25340],{"text":25333,"start":6752,"end":6808},"Es soll auch 'n Blogpost kommen tatsächlich von Jared, der hat gesagt, also erst mal nur 'n p r gemacht.",{"text":25335,"start":6808,"end":6846},"Blogpost wird auf jeden Fall noch mal folgen, war bis Stand heute noch nicht da.",{"text":25337,"start":6850,"end":6900},"Gegenseite hat natürlich gesagt so, na ja, irgendwie fühlt sich's an wie einfach nur 'n AI Showcase ehrlicherweise, ne.",{"text":25339,"start":6903,"end":6993},"Also ich glaub, wir haben auch vor ungefähr 'nem halben Jahr, es müsste, glaub ich, so irgendwie Dezember gewesen sein, haben wir darüber berichtet, dass Anthropic Bun gekauft hat, ne, bei soner Acquisition.",{"text":25341,"start":6993,"end":7012},"Ich glaub, Fabi hat damals drüber erzählt.",94,{"sentences":25344,"speaker":325,"num_words":25355,"start":7015,"end":7325},[25345,25347,25349,25351,25353],{"text":25346,"start":7015,"end":7064},"Und natürlich kann man jetzt sagen, sone Anthropic will halt zeigen so, hey, guck mal, was Claude alles kann, ne.",{"text":25348,"start":7064,"end":7166},"Hier Bun kennt ihr ja alle, superbeliebtes Produkt, supergroßes Open Source Produkt und hier allein mit Claude konnten wir jetzt alles einfach rüber machen zu Rust Und das ist einfach son Vorzeigeprojekt dafür, ne.",{"text":25350,"start":7169,"end":7239},"Muss man auch ehrlicherweise sagen, da ist auch ein Stück Wahrheit dran, denn es ist natürlich, was immer heiß diskutiert wird, wie viel Ai Slop ist da drin?",{"text":25352,"start":7239,"end":7300},"Und der Faktor ist durchaus vorhanden, muss man sagen, denn ich habe ja vorhin diesen angesprochen, der so Memory leaks verhindert, ne.",{"text":25354,"start":7300,"end":7325},"Und das halt also der große Vorteil eigentlich an Rust.",114,{"sentences":25357,"speaker":325,"num_words":25368,"start":7329,"end":7642},[25358,25360,25362,25364,25366],{"text":25359,"start":7329,"end":7422},"Und den kann man aber auch deaktivieren, indem man einfach schreibt und dann alles, was da ist, so sagst Du quasi dem dem Rust Compiler so, ja, ja, ich ich achte darauf, dass hier alles sicher ist.",{"text":25361,"start":7422,"end":7474},"Und damit umgehst Du halt eigentlich das Ganze und es wurd halt einfach quasi 1 zu 1 von SEK übersetzt so.",{"text":25363,"start":7474,"end":7540},"Also quasi Du hast halt kein idiomatisches Rust, sondern es ist halt wirklich einfach nur 'n 1 zu 1 Import, ohne wirklich die die Sprache zu berücksichtigen.",{"text":25365,"start":7544,"end":7602},"Wurde aber auch an der Stelle von Jared schon gesagt so, hey, ja, ja, wissen wir, da kommen 'n paar Follow-upares, ne?",{"text":25367,"start":7602,"end":7642},"Das wird wahrscheinlich auch alles mit der AI immer stückweise dann noch mal nachgeliefert, ne.",122,{"sentences":25370,"speaker":325,"num_words":25381,"start":7645,"end":7862},[25371,25373,25375,25377,25379],{"text":25372,"start":7645,"end":7692},"Aber ist ist trotzdem so, dass das Stimmungsbild dadurch irgendwie trotzdem 'n bisschen negativ war, sag ich mal.",{"text":25374,"start":7695,"end":7724},"Und jetzt vielleicht son bisschen so meine Meinung und auch danach gerne eure so.",{"text":25376,"start":7727,"end":7755},"Also erstens, ich find das schon also wahnsinnig beeindruckend so, ne.",{"text":25378,"start":7755,"end":7811},"Ich meine, also das ist schon krasser Scale, erst mal so 1000000 Zeilencodes so irgendwie noch mal, das komplett irgendwie umgeschrieben.",{"text":25380,"start":7815,"end":7862},"Es also also es ist funktional, meine Relieaks wurden behoben so, es ist auch kleiner geworden so.",81,{"sentences":25383,"speaker":325,"num_words":25394,"start":7862,"end":8011},[25384,25386,25388,25390,25392],{"text":25385,"start":7862,"end":7911},"Irgendwie ist es schon auf jeden Fall beeindruckend, ne, weil man sich so was vorher gar nicht vorstellen konnte.",{"text":25387,"start":7914,"end":7975},"Vor allem grad, ne, in dieser Diskussion davon, man hätt sich wahrscheinlich länger überlegt so, ja, lohnt sich jetzt dieser Reeride?",{"text":25389,"start":7975,"end":7985},"Machen wir das wirklich?",{"text":25391,"start":7985,"end":7999},"Wie viele Entwickler brauchen wir?",{"text":25393,"start":7999,"end":8011},"Wie lange dauert das?",53,{"sentences":25396,"speaker":325,"num_words":25407,"start":8011,"end":8285},[25397,25399,25401,25403,25405],{"text":25398,"start":8011,"end":8031},"Was ist dann so der Outcom Ende?",{"text":25400,"start":8031,"end":8121},"So und wahrscheinlich würd's man's eher nicht machen oder sehr stark depriorisieren oder man hätten noch mal oder müssen wir sagen, hey, das muss ich halt noch x Jahre rentieren, damit sich dieser Revit jetzt lohnt.",{"text":25402,"start":8121,"end":8167},"Von daher ist jetzt irgendwie einfach krass, so diesen Schritt zu machen, na ja, wir machen's einfach.",{"text":25404,"start":8167,"end":8188},"So, das find ich also schon irgendwie ganz cool.",{"text":25406,"start":8191,"end":8285},"Und weil da ja auch irgendwie viele Leute so bisschen Sorgen hatten, na ja, das ist jetzt irgendwie alles fehleranfälliger und das wird dann irgendwie auch mal crashen und das ist nicht mehr so gut benutzbar wie davor.",107,{"sentences":25409,"speaker":325,"num_words":24798,"start":8285,"end":8417},[25410,25412,25414,25416],{"text":25411,"start":8285,"end":8340},"Ich hab tatsächlich also so zum einen irgendwie relativ viel Trust in der AI tatsächlich einfach so was umzuschreiben, so.",{"text":25413,"start":8340,"end":8366},"Ich denk mir so irgendwie, das das kann das gut.",{"text":25415,"start":8368,"end":8394},"Und zweitens hab ich auch irgendwie 'n starken Trust in einfach.",{"text":25417,"start":8397,"end":8417},"Erstens, weil's halt sone sehr stark basierte Sprache ist.",{"sentences":25419,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":8417,"end":8430},[25420],{"text":25421,"start":8417,"end":8430},"Und auch schon sehr lange.",{"sentences":25423,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":8430,"end":8446},[25424],{"text":25425,"start":8430,"end":8446},"Und gibt's auch schon sehr lange.",{"sentences":25427,"speaker":125,"num_words":24835,"start":8449,"end":8479},[25428],{"text":25429,"start":8449,"end":8479},"Ich mein, man kann ja auch gar nicht ohne schreiben, ja.",{"sentences":25431,"speaker":325,"num_words":24924,"start":8479,"end":8510},[25432,25434],{"text":25433,"start":8479,"end":8506},"Ja, eben, eben, das steckt hier sogar einfach drin.",{"text":8511,"start":8509,"end":8510},{"sentences":25436,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":8510,"end":8529},[25437],{"text":25438,"start":8510,"end":8529},"Alter, so, David's nicht schlecht.",{"sentences":25440,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":8529,"end":8537},[25441],{"text":25442,"start":8529,"end":8537},"Ja, aber",{"sentences":25444,"speaker":325,"num_words":25455,"start":8537,"end":8696},[25445,25447,25449,25451,25453],{"text":25446,"start":8537,"end":8551},"es war es war wirklich gut.",{"text":25448,"start":8551,"end":8562},"80 Prozent Trust ist.",{"text":25450,"start":8565,"end":8583},"Genau, und dann jedenfalls diese starke Typisierung.",{"text":25452,"start":8583,"end":8627},"Das heißt eigentlich, der der Compiler wird ja vorher fehlschlagen, wenn irgendwas auch schlecht halt umgeschrieben ist, so.",{"text":25454,"start":8627,"end":8696},"Das heißt, Du kannst halt irgendwie nicht so fehlerhaften Coach schreiben wie beispielsweise bei JavaScript oder so was alles, ne, der dann halt erst so zu knallt.",62,{"sentences":25457,"speaker":325,"num_words":25468,"start":8699,"end":8866},[25458,25460,25462,25464,25466],{"text":25459,"start":8699,"end":8744},"Von daher ist irgendwie so, dass also mein mein Glaube daran, dass das echt gut funktioniert hat, sehr hoch.",{"text":25461,"start":8747,"end":8764},"Ist spannend, das auf jeden Fall auszuprobieren.",{"text":25463,"start":8768,"end":8809},"Und irgendwie irgendwie auch cool, son bisschen diese Vorreiterstellung von Band zu sagen, ja, wisst ihr was?",{"text":25465,"start":8809,"end":8842},"Komm, wir machen einfach und machen das und diese bisschen diese Vorreiterstellung so.",{"text":25467,"start":8842,"end":8866},"Find ich geil so einfach so von der Attitude.",65,{"sentences":25470,"speaker":325,"num_words":24924,"start":8870,"end":8893},[25471],{"text":25472,"start":8870,"end":8893},"Aber genau, auch außer spannend natürlich, was ihr dazu sagt.",{"sentences":25474,"speaker":125,"num_words":25485,"start":8896,"end":9107},[25475,25477,25479,25481,25483],{"text":25476,"start":8896,"end":8940},"Mich, also mich wundert das gar nicht so sehr, dass dieser geklappt hat wie dich, glaub ich.",{"text":25478,"start":8945,"end":9019},"Insbesondere, wenn man sich anschaut, dass, wie Du ja gesagt hast, sie einfach nur viel sick in Rust portiert haben und halt nicht rustspezifische Sachen irgendwie verwendet haben.",{"text":25480,"start":9019,"end":9028},"Ich glaube, Mhm.",{"text":25482,"start":9032,"end":9088},"Interessanter wäre gewesen, wenn sie wirklich sone Cleanroom Implementation gemacht hätten, gesagt hätten, hier ist die Testsuite von bun.",{"text":25484,"start":9092,"end":9107},"So, das ist alles, was funktionieren muss.",74,{"sentences":25487,"speaker":125,"num_words":24852,"start":9111,"end":9276},[25488,25490,25492,25494,25495],{"text":25489,"start":9111,"end":9174},"Und jetzt baust Du quasi so lange, bis Du halt all diese Tests irgendwie hinkriegst, ja, aber ohne die bestehende Code Base halt anzugucken.",{"text":25491,"start":9174,"end":9192},"Einfach nur, auch halt fresh.",{"text":25493,"start":9196,"end":9225},"Weil was dabei rauskommt, wär wahrscheinlich 'n viel nativeres Produkt gewesen.",{"text":9232,"start":9229,"end":9230},{"text":25496,"start":9230,"end":9276},"Und da hätte er dann wirklich mal schauen können, okay, wie viel Unterschied ergibt sich halt wirklich, ja?",{"sentences":25498,"speaker":125,"num_words":25505,"start":9276,"end":9567},[25499,25501,25503],{"text":25500,"start":9276,"end":9424},"Jetzt ist, glaub ich, eher das Spannende, was im Nachgang damit passiert, ob diese ganzen Sick Artefakte, die jetzt in der Code Base drin sind, ob die halt noch aufgeräumt werden und wenn ja, ob das von Hand gemacht werden muss und ob das auch maschinell passiert und wie groß dann der Performancegain halt irgendwie ist, ja?",{"text":25502,"start":9424,"end":9516},"Weil wenn sie jetzt, wie Du am Anfang gesagt hast, so paritär da irgendwie unterwegs sind, sich ungefähr gleich verhalten von Performance und so was, obwohl sie noch diese ganze im Prinzip mitportiert haben, ja, Mhm.",{"text":25504,"start":9518,"end":9567},"Dann steht ja eigentlich zu hoffen, dass, wenn das mal ordentlich aufgeräumt ist, es dann wirklich noch besser werden kann.",113,{"sentences":25507,"speaker":105,"num_words":105,"start":9570,"end":9571},[25508],{"text":665,"start":9570,"end":9571},{"sentences":25510,"speaker":125,"num_words":24956,"start":9574,"end":9693},[25511,25513,25514],{"text":25512,"start":9574,"end":9671},"Aber ansonsten glaube ich, getestete Projekte zu portieren ist wahrscheinlich sogar einfacher, als wenn ich ihm jetzt die ungetestete programmierbarplattform hinwerfen würde und sagen würde, portier mir das mal zu oder Go oder keine Ahnung was.",{"text":665,"start":9671,"end":9674},{"text":25515,"start":9674,"end":9693},"Wo dann vorne und hinten alles kaputtgeht.",{"sentences":25517,"speaker":105,"num_words":25528,"start":9697,"end":10079},[25518,25520,25522,25524,25526],{"text":25519,"start":9697,"end":9707},"Das wär auch mein Take.",{"text":25521,"start":9707,"end":9865},"Also ich glaube immer son son viel genutztes öffentliches Ding, Frameworkprojekt, was auch immer, was eine hohe Testabdeckung hat, da ist es natürlich wirklich 'n Einfacheres, das in in ähnlicher Qualität irgendwie irgendwie nachzubauen Und trotzdem natürlich beeindruckend, dass das geht in dem Skate und dass einfach dann irgendwo mehr oder weniger funktioniert und auch in diesem Zeitrahmen funktioniert.",{"text":25523,"start":9868,"end":9952},"Und grundsätzlich ist es, glaub ich, am Ende würde ich jetzt, ohne jetzt in den Details drin zu sein, würd ich sagen, hörst Du dir erst mal nach 'ner vernünftigen Entscheidung an.",{"text":25525,"start":9952,"end":9993},"Ich mein, wir werden uns immer weiter dahin entwickeln, dass viel mehr Teile von AI umgesetzt werden.",{"text":25527,"start":9993,"end":10079},"Und wenn jetzt auch das eine Entscheidung ist, dass es halt viel mehr Trainingsdaten, Ressourcen et cetera in in Rust gibt, das Ganze zu machen und dass die Sprache, also womit das einfacher funktioniert.",147,{"sentences":25530,"speaker":105,"num_words":25539,"start":10079,"end":10270},[25531,25533,25535,25537],{"text":25532,"start":10079,"end":10088},"Ja, ja klar.",{"text":25534,"start":10088,"end":10125},"Und man sicherer ist und so und und und so weiter, dann macht das Sinn.",{"text":25536,"start":10125,"end":10228},"Und wenn Du halt einfach so wechseln kannst und jetzt ist die Hoffnung, dass da nicht massiv technische Schulden irgendwie aufgebaut wurden, aber dafür, wie gesagt, funktioniert es ja erst mal und ist nicht schlechter, beziehungsweise teilweise besser, Mhm.",{"text":25538,"start":10230,"end":10270},"Dann kann man daran ja jetzt genauso mit AI rumoptimieren und die nächsten 100 generieren lassen.",73,{"sentences":25541,"speaker":325,"num_words":105,"start":10273,"end":10274},[25542],{"text":9029,"start":10273,"end":10274},{"sentences":25544,"speaker":125,"num_words":25549,"start":10277,"end":10469},[25545,25547],{"text":25546,"start":10277,"end":10400},"Ich frag mich, wie sehr sich Microsoft grade son bisschen geärgert fühlt, weil die doch vor 'n paar Monaten diesen irgendwie angekündigt haben und das son ewig langes Projekt ist und sie so ultravorsichtig mit, wie machen wir diese Transition und bla bla bla so, ja.",{"text":25548,"start":10400,"end":10469},"Und wenn jetzt ab wann einfach so die Ecke kommt, so, ja, ich hab da mal nachts irgendwie sonen Purry Quest aufgemacht Ist",69,{"sentences":25551,"speaker":325,"num_words":24787,"start":10469,"end":10511},[25552,25554,25556,25558],{"text":25553,"start":10469,"end":10479},"auch schon gemerkt.",{"text":25555,"start":10483,"end":10498},"So, ja, ja, das macht schon alles.",{"text":25557,"start":10501,"end":10505},"Ja, stimmt.",{"text":25559,"start":10505,"end":10511},"Und jetzt",{"sentences":25561,"speaker":125,"num_words":25566,"start":10511,"end":10628},[25562,25564],{"text":25563,"start":10511,"end":10551},"ist Fedic, das ist natürlich auch son son krasses Kontrastprogramm, ja, wo man Ja.",{"text":25565,"start":10553,"end":10628},"Ja eigentlich auch Microsoft unterstellen könnte, dass sie so die Power von Open AI irgendwie haben und das natürlich auch für 'n cooler cooler Move so sein könnte.",42,{"sentences":25568,"speaker":105,"num_words":25579,"start":10631,"end":10830},[25569,25571,25573,25575,25577],{"text":25570,"start":10631,"end":10642},"Ja, aber hey, also ja.",{"text":25572,"start":10642,"end":10693},"Und grade solche Use Cases braucht es ja auch, irgendwie zu demonstrieren, ne, was was irgendwie möglich ist.",{"text":25574,"start":10693,"end":10770},"Ich finde, das ist ja auch immer noch 1, also und wenn es ne zu gehört, ist das halt mit Sicherheit Teil davon irgendwie zu zeigen, so was.",{"text":25576,"start":10770,"end":10780},"Was sind die Möglichkeiten?",{"text":25578,"start":10783,"end":10830},"Würde mich ja noch mal super interessieren so, was dann am Ende die Kosten auch waren beziehungsweise ne, also das",75,{"sentences":25581,"speaker":325,"num_words":24742,"start":10830,"end":10842},[25582],{"text":25583,"start":10830,"end":10842},"ist ja dann vielleicht immer",{"sentences":25585,"speaker":105,"num_words":24872,"start":10842,"end":10898},[25586],{"text":25587,"start":10842,"end":10898},"noch mal 'n anderes Setting, wenn Du so inhouse als Dropic Test machst, was was Ressourcengeschwindigkeit Komplett getroffen,",{"sentences":25589,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":10898,"end":10909},[25590],{"text":25591,"start":10898,"end":10909},"ballert, Phasen,",{"sentences":25593,"speaker":105,"num_words":25598,"start":10909,"end":10955},[25594,25596],{"text":25595,"start":10909,"end":10929},"1000 Sub Agents, keine Ahnung.",{"text":25597,"start":10933,"end":10955},"Aber kommt vielleicht in den Blogposten noch 'n bisschen was.",15,{"sentences":25600,"speaker":325,"num_words":25610,"start":10955,"end":11034},[25601,25603,25605,25606,25608],{"text":25602,"start":10955,"end":10961},"Ja, genau.",{"text":25604,"start":10961,"end":10999},"Ich glaub, da wird das noch mal 'n bisschen elaborierter aufgedröselt, was alles war.",{"text":665,"start":10999,"end":11001},{"text":25607,"start":11003,"end":11011},"Kein Take mehr.",{"text":25609,"start":11014,"end":11034},"Ja, krass, nur durchaus positiv in der Runde.",28,{"sentences":25612,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":11037,"end":11047},[25613],{"text":25614,"start":11037,"end":11047},"Komm, dafür jetzt kommt Jan.",{"sentences":25616,"speaker":125,"num_words":25304,"start":11047,"end":11090},[25617,25619],{"text":25618,"start":11047,"end":11065},"Ich wollt grad sagen, son bisschen.",{"text":25620,"start":11070,"end":11090},"Tour noch sone Stimmung zu kippen hier.",{"sentences":25622,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":11090,"end":11114},[25623,25624],{"text":4254,"start":11090,"end":11092},{"text":25625,"start":11095,"end":11114},"Warum ist Antropic scheiße, Jan?",{"sentences":25627,"speaker":125,"num_words":25266,"start":11117,"end":11270},[25628,25630,25632,25634,25636],{"text":25629,"start":11117,"end":11141},"Na, also okay, vielleicht kurzer Disclaimer vorne ab so.",{"text":25631,"start":11144,"end":11177},"Ich hasse nicht allgemein AI, auch wenn Dennis mir das immer so unterstellt.",{"text":25633,"start":11177,"end":11210},"Ich benutze AI gerne, vielleicht 'n bisschen kritischer als manch andere oder so.",{"text":25635,"start":11210,"end":11231},"Ja, aber ich hab trotzdem irgendwie Spaß damit.",{"text":25637,"start":11234,"end":11270},"Aber und ich glaub, diese Diskussion hat angefangen in unserer letzten AI Week, ne.",{"sentences":25639,"speaker":125,"num_words":25650,"start":11270,"end":11568},[25640,25642,25644,25646,25648],{"text":25641,"start":11270,"end":11379},"Da hatten wir son paar Diskussionen hier geführt, mal 'n bisschen länger und haben uns son bisschen angefangen, damit zu beschäftigen, so okay, was für was fürn moralischen Anspruch muss man eigentlich an son legitime Frage ist aus 2 Gründen.",{"text":25643,"start":11379,"end":11437},"Also ne, warum stellt man sich nicht dieselben Fragen bei jedem Datenbankanbieter oder Hoster oder so was, den man verwendet, ja?",{"text":25645,"start":11437,"end":11459},"Also warum werden die Leute bei AI irgendwie viel kritischer?",{"text":25647,"start":11462,"end":11543},"Ich glaub zum einen, weil natürlich alle irgendwie bemüht sind, diesen Systemen irgendwie maximal viel Autonomie und und Spielraum und am Ende halt auch irgendwie Geld rüberzuschieben so, ja.",{"text":25649,"start":11543,"end":11568},"Und mit mehr Anforderung kommt halt auch irgendwie mehr Erwartungshaltung.",110,{"sentences":25652,"speaker":125,"num_words":25662,"start":11571,"end":11902},[25653,25655,25657,25658,25660],{"text":25654,"start":11571,"end":11729},"Und wenn sich natürlich alle diese Anbieter irgendwie auf die Fahne schreiben, dass sie hier irgendwie AGI erreichen wollen und superautonome menschliche Agenten bauen und bla bla bla, da ist natürlich so ihr Verhalten auch son bisschen Rückspiegelung auf, na ja, wie verhalten sich halt dieses oder was kann man von diesem System am Ende des Tages erwarten, ja?",{"text":25656,"start":11729,"end":11757},"Und deshalb gibt's da, glaub ich, generell eine eine andere Erwartungshaltung.",{"text":11763,"start":11759,"end":11760},{"text":25659,"start":11765,"end":11774},"Mit dem, ja.",{"text":25661,"start":11777,"end":11902},"Ich hab, glaub ich, sone sehr Achterbahnartige Reise da irgendwie hinter mir und mich würde mal so euer Take dazu interessieren, weil gefühlt sind es ja immer so Zyklen von 1 von diesen Anbietern macht irgendwie was mega Cooles und alle springen drauf und dann werden wir irgendwie enttäuscht.",123,{"sentences":25664,"speaker":125,"num_words":25182,"start":11906,"end":12164},[25665,25666,25668,25670,25672],{"text":11763,"start":11906,"end":11907},{"text":25667,"start":11910,"end":11983},"Also Open AI war superlange irgendwie das das Lieblingskind von allen, ja, insbesondere ganz, ganz, ganz am Anfang, als sie noch mit so offenen GPT Modellen gearbeitet hat.",{"text":25669,"start":11983,"end":12014},"Man konnte die Paper dazu lesen, man konnte das selber ausprobieren.",{"text":25671,"start":12018,"end":12133},"Sie hatten irgendwie so diesen Ansatz von, wir sind hier dieses Non profit Lab, was irgendwie nur Gutes erreichen will und sammeln dafür Venturekapital ein, aber verballern das eigentlich, hier so die Menschheit voranzubringen und alle so yeah und das klappt schon.",{"text":25673,"start":12133,"end":12164},"Sie hatten irgendwie eigene Teams dafür, die sich damit beschäftigt haben.",{"sentences":25675,"speaker":125,"num_words":325,"start":12164,"end":12170},[25676],{"text":25677,"start":12164,"end":12170},"Na ja,",{"sentences":25679,"speaker":325,"num_words":25304,"start":12173,"end":12207},[25680],{"text":25681,"start":12173,"end":12207},"Kurze Frage war das war das noch zu GPT-zwei-Zeiten oder wann war das?",{"sentences":25683,"speaker":125,"num_words":25692,"start":12209,"end":12294},[25684,25686,25688,25690],{"text":25685,"start":12209,"end":12245},"Ja, das war so GPT generell und GPT-zwei und so, so wirklich ganz früh.",{"text":25687,"start":12245,"end":12278},"Wir sind hier so Ja, wir sind 20, 18, 19.",{"text":25689,"start":12281,"end":12284},"Ja, krass.",{"text":25691,"start":12284,"end":12294},"Ne, also sehr gut.",30,{"sentences":25694,"speaker":325,"num_words":24778,"start":12294,"end":12338},[25695,25697],{"text":25696,"start":12294,"end":12329},"Also jetzt hab ich auch was Neues gelernt, das muss ich gar nicht.",{"text":25698,"start":12329,"end":12338},"Was war das?",{"sentences":25700,"speaker":105,"num_words":325,"start":12342,"end":12348},[25701],{"text":25702,"start":12342,"end":12348},"TypT 2?",{"sentences":25704,"speaker":125,"num_words":25710,"start":12352,"end":12417},[25705,25707,25708],{"text":25706,"start":12352,"end":12391},"Ja, da war ich noch bei Shopify Lass es mal 21 oder 22 gewesen sein.",{"text":1771,"start":12393,"end":12394},{"text":25709,"start":12394,"end":12417},"Nicht früher, JPC 2 und 3, ne?",23,{"sentences":25712,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":12419,"end":12435},[25713,25714],{"text":9029,"start":12419,"end":12420},{"text":25715,"start":12420,"end":12435},"Okay, so weiter im Text.",{"sentences":25717,"speaker":125,"num_words":25650,"start":12435,"end":12731},[25718,25720,25722,25724,25726],{"text":25719,"start":12435,"end":12456},"Auf alle Fälle und bla bla bla.",{"text":25721,"start":12459,"end":12588},"Und dann haben sie halt irgendwie so angefangen, sobald sie gesehen haben, oh, man kann aus ChatGPT irgendwie 'n cooles Produkt machen und lass doch mal diesen Non Profit Ansatz über Bord schmeißen und damit irgendwie ordentlich Geld verdienen und lass doch auch mal dieses Safety und Alignment Team irgendwie rausschmeißen.",{"text":25723,"start":12588,"end":12606},"Die halten uns nur alle irgendwie zurück.",{"text":25725,"start":12610,"end":12673},"Und dann diese ganze Geschichte, wie sie Sam Ortman gefeuert haben und wieder reingeholt haben und dann das halbe Board rausgeschmissen und so.",{"text":25727,"start":12673,"end":12731},"Also es hat halt irgendwie alles son sehr faden Beigeschmack von dieser dieser moralische Kompass, den man irgendwie am Anfang zugetraut hat.",{"sentences":25729,"speaker":125,"num_words":25381,"start":12731,"end":12958},[25730,25732,25734,25736,25738],{"text":25731,"start":12731,"end":12769},"Der ist halt irgendwie verloren gegangen so in in the process, so.",{"text":25733,"start":12771,"end":12785},"Dann kommt irgendwie auf die Bühne.",{"text":25735,"start":12785,"end":12889},"Ich glaub, 20 21, 22 haben die auch damit angefangen, mit Leuten, von Leuten gegründet, die bei OpenAI rausgegangen sind, weil sie halt genau das bemängelt haben, ne, gesagt haben, oh, zu viel Kommerz, zu wenig Sicherheit.",{"text":25737,"start":12892,"end":12902},"Wir wir machen das anders.",{"text":25739,"start":12902,"end":12958},"Wir machen hier 'n Safety First AI Laden auf und wir haben irgendwie Grundsätze und wollen das durchziehen und und bla.",{"sentences":25741,"speaker":125,"num_words":25746,"start":12960,"end":13118},[25742,25744],{"text":25743,"start":12960,"end":13019},"Und das war irgendwie da alles wieder cool und alle hatten irgendwie ihr neues Lieblings AI Kind gefunden und sind da irgendwie drauf gesprungen.",{"text":25745,"start":13022,"end":13118},"Und dann, na ja, also es war von Anfang an vielleicht son bisschen schwierig mit denen, wenn man da guckt, wer da auch vielleicht als Investor dringesessen hat und wie das alles so funktioniert hat, aber auf alle Fälle",63,{"sentences":25748,"speaker":325,"num_words":24758,"start":13120,"end":13129},[25749],{"text":25750,"start":13120,"end":13129},"Wer denn zum Beispiel?",{"sentences":25752,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":13132,"end":13145},[25753],{"text":25754,"start":13132,"end":13145},"Der gehört ja, weißt Du?",{"sentences":25756,"speaker":125,"num_words":25203,"start":13145,"end":13447},[25757,25759,25761,25762,25764],{"text":25758,"start":13145,"end":13219},"Also, ne, man ist jetzt eine andere Diskussion, wie weit will man quasi ein Unternehmen dafür verantwortlich machen, wer da als Investor drinsitzt und wie die sich verhalten, ja.",{"text":25760,"start":13219,"end":13343},"Aber wenn man sich anguckt, dass da irgendwie so Sam Bankman Fried, der ja mit FTX diesen großen Krypto Scam quasi an die Wand gefahren hat, der hat da irgendwie, glaub ich, am Anfang 'n paar 100000000 Dollar reingesteckt, das aufzubauen, so schwierig.",{"text":9029,"start":13343,"end":13346},{"text":25763,"start":13346,"end":13390},"Anyway, Intropic geht irgendwie durch die Decke, alles megacool, bis sie jetzt anfangen.",{"text":25765,"start":13390,"end":13447},"Komische Sachen mit Pricing und SDK Restriktions und wer darf überhaupt unsere API nutzen und für was und überhaupt.",{"sentences":25767,"speaker":125,"num_words":25777,"start":13447,"end":13669},[25768,25770,25772,25774,25775],{"text":25769,"start":13447,"end":13473},"Da kann man doch sagen, na ja, ne, ist halt 'n Business.",{"text":25771,"start":13473,"end":13497},"Die dürfen selber entscheiden, wem sie ihr Produkt verkaufen.",{"text":25773,"start":13497,"end":13584},"Haben sie ja im im Pentagon Fall auch irgendwie gemacht und da waren wir alle irgendwie auf ihrer Seite zu sagen, so hey, verkauft das mal nicht irgendwie an die Rüstungsindustrie, das ist alles cool.",{"text":9029,"start":13584,"end":13586},{"text":25776,"start":13588,"end":13669},"Und dann kamen da so Deals wie, ja, ja, zahlt jetzt jeden Monat irgendwie anderthalb Milliarden Dollar oder so was an xA I, ihre Datencenter zu mieten.",84,{"sentences":25779,"speaker":125,"num_words":25790,"start":13672,"end":14103},[25780,25782,25784,25786,25788],{"text":25781,"start":13672,"end":13744},"Das vielleicht auch irgendwie uncool und man will nicht das Geld irgendwie dahin geht, weil Ex und Grok und Musk irgendwie son ganz komischer eigener Sumpf sind.",{"text":25783,"start":13744,"end":13814},"Und den finanziert man jetzt quasi sehr direkt mit, wenn man irgendwie 'n nutzt, weil sie halt auf die Hardware und die Rechenzentren von denen angewiesen sind.",{"text":25785,"start":13816,"end":13823},"Schwierig, schwierig, schwierig.",{"text":25787,"start":13825,"end":14072},"Dann gab's irgendwie noch Mysteral aus Europa und alle so, weniger Abhängigkeit irgendwie nach nach USA und die haben sich auf die Fahne geschrieben, dass irgendwie auch so Open Source AI zu bauen und irgendwie Independence halt für diesen ganzen US Tech Konzernen aufzubauen und haben dann auch son bisschen gelobyt gegen den oder an dem EU AI Act rumzuschrauben, dass es halt nicht zu strengen wird und dass wir ja auch eigene Sachen aufbauen können und son bisschen mit diesen Frontier Labs aus Nordamerika konkurrieren können und bla.",{"text":25789,"start":14074,"end":14103},"Bis sie dann, nachdem das halt irgendwie alles durch waren, gesagt haben, na",159,{"sentences":25792,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":14103,"end":14108},[25793],{"text":25794,"start":14103,"end":14108},"ja, wir",{"sentences":25796,"speaker":125,"num_words":25807,"start":14108,"end":14367},[25797,25799,25801,25803,25805],{"text":25798,"start":14108,"end":14128},"machen jetzt halt sonen exklusiven Deal mit Microsoft.",{"text":25800,"start":14132,"end":14251},"Das mit diesem ganzen Open Source EU Zeug, das müssen wir eigentlich alles gar nicht so wichtig nehmen Und wir vertreiben jetzt unser Zeug exklusiv eben über Microsoft, die investieren, die kriegen hier 'n Anteil bei uns und das war irgendwie dahin mit der schönen EU Souveränität.",{"text":25802,"start":14254,"end":14296},"Und das, also ich weiß nicht, man kann hier noch, man können bestimmt auch über Google reden.",{"text":25804,"start":14296,"end":14349},"Ich weiß nicht, ob wir über Meta und Excel noch getrennt reden müssen, aber die Story ist halt gefühlt immer dasselbe.",{"text":25806,"start":14349,"end":14367},"Es kommt 'n cooles Produkt raus, ja.",100,{"sentences":25809,"speaker":125,"num_words":25455,"start":14367,"end":14519},[25810,25812,25814,25816],{"text":25811,"start":14367,"end":14402},"Lama haben auch irgendwie alle abgefeiert am Anfang, als es frisch und neu war.",{"text":25813,"start":14404,"end":14421},"Und dann irgendwie kippt diese ganze Geschichte wieder.",{"text":25815,"start":14423,"end":14499},"Und gefühlt sitze ich immer da, wenn ich diese Produkte benutze und freu mich, wie cool sie funktionieren und fühl mich gleichzeitig so schlecht dabei, wo sie irgendwie so herkommen, ja?",{"text":25817,"start":14499,"end":14519},"Und da würde mich mal mal euer Take interessieren.",{"sentences":25819,"speaker":325,"num_words":25790,"start":14522,"end":14906},[25820,25822,25824,25826,25828],{"text":25821,"start":14522,"end":14561},"Oh, ich find einfach so, das das größte Thema ist ja einfach hier, also Wirtschaftlichkeit, oder?",{"text":25823,"start":14561,"end":14693},"Also ich glaub, das ist halt so einfach so der größte Knackpunkt und also ne, man man man man kann mit 'ner gewissen Moralvorstellung ja auch irgendwie in die Sache reingehen und und für etwas stehen, Aber man weiß ja auch, wie wie wie teuer einfach dieser gesamte AI Kram ist so, ne.",{"text":25825,"start":14693,"end":14735},"Sei es halt in der Forschung, sei es das dann auch zu betreiben und so was alles.",{"text":25827,"start":14737,"end":14874},"Und ich kann mir das schon durchaus, was jemand sagt, na ja, es muss halt irgendwie wirtschaftlich sein am Ende oder wir gehen halt irgendwie pleite und zum Teil musst Du dann son bisschen vielleicht dein deine Werte verkaufen und sagen, hey, okay, ja gut, dann ist jetzt irgendwie Microsoft da, die uns da voll viel Geld für geben.",{"text":25829,"start":14874,"end":14906},"Das finanziert uns auf jeden Fall und wir können weiter irgendwie coole Dinge machen.",{"sentences":25831,"speaker":325,"num_words":25842,"start":14906,"end":15090},[25832,25834,25836,25838,25840],{"text":25833,"start":14906,"end":14947},"Die andere Option wäre, na ja, es ist nicht wirtschaftlich, es es passt halt irgendwie nicht weiter.",{"text":25835,"start":14947,"end":15009},"Und ich glaub, das ist halt son bisschen leider irgendwie sone notgedrungene Sache dann immer an der Stelle, halt weil's halt eben so teuer ist.",{"text":25837,"start":15009,"end":15029},"Ich glaub, das ist so durchaus der größte Faktor.",{"text":25839,"start":15032,"end":15077},"Und ich glaub und dann kann man natürlich dann entscheiden so, wie also wie betrachten man das Ganze moralisch so.",{"text":25841,"start":15077,"end":15090},"Das wär natürlich die nächste Frage.",77,{"sentences":25844,"speaker":325,"num_words":105,"start":15093,"end":15094},[25845],{"text":15096,"start":15093,"end":15094},{"sentences":25847,"speaker":105,"num_words":25342,"start":15098,"end":15353},[25848,25850,25852,25854],{"text":25849,"start":15098,"end":15227},"Kann man wahrscheinlich, ja, kann man wahrscheinlich wieder sehr, also entweder mit 'nem sehr pessimistischen oder optimistischen Blick irgendwie drauf gucken, weil Du hast am Anfang ja auch selbst den Vergleich gezogen, ja, zu den ganzen anderen Dingen, die wir irgendwie nutzen und wo wir uns vielleicht nicht so viele Gedanken machen.",{"text":25851,"start":15229,"end":15247},"Und vielleicht ist da das da irgendwo vergleichbar.",{"text":25853,"start":15250,"end":15341},"Also ne, ist jetzt die Google Cloud oder die ABS Cloud oder ne, was also oder auch einfach jegliches jegliche Dienst, den man hat mit Linear, mit wo zahlen wir noch viel?",{"text":25855,"start":15346,"end":15353},"Miro, Slack.",{"sentences":25857,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":15359,"end":15366},[25858,25859],{"text":15363,"start":15359,"end":15360},{"text":15367,"start":15365,"end":15366},{"sentences":25861,"speaker":105,"num_words":25870,"start":15369,"end":15637},[25862,25864,25866,25868],{"text":25863,"start":15369,"end":15378},"Ne, keine Ahnung was.",{"text":25865,"start":15378,"end":15408},"Das sind ja überall alles so Fragen, jetzt speziell bei uns.",{"text":25867,"start":15408,"end":15457},"Wir sind ziemlich groß auf der auf Facebook, Instant Games so als Partner mit mit Matter.",{"text":25869,"start":15460,"end":15637},"Finde ich schwierig und ja klar ist es dann auch noch mal, aber ich glaub, das ist dann irgendwie auch dann am Ende irgendwie die Realität, die dann auf die Unternehmen so niederprasselt, ne, wenn Du irgendwie da startest und sagst, hey, wir sind die Guten und wir machen das jetzt so moralisch alles richtig und haben irgendwo auch diese Ansprüche, das zerschellt dann vielleicht einfach son bisschen an der harten Realität, weil",104,{"sentences":25872,"speaker":456,"num_words":105,"start":15639,"end":15640},[25873],{"text":9029,"start":15639,"end":15640},{"sentences":25875,"speaker":105,"num_words":2148,"start":15643,"end":16108},[25876,25878,25880,25882,25884],{"text":25877,"start":15643,"end":15762},"Wenn Du's dann nicht veröffentlichst beispielsweise, ne, irgendwie jetzt einen Modell und sagst, ja, nee, da müssen wir noch 'n bisschen gucken und Training, keine Ahnung was, dann macht's halt 'n anderer und verdient halt dann vor dir das Geld damit und Du bist vielleicht abgeschnitten.",{"text":25879,"start":15766,"end":15857},"Und natürlich ist das irgendwo gesellschaftlich kacke, dass es so ist, aber ich mein, das ist halt irgendwie der Kapitalismus, in dem wir leben und wo es halt darum geht, möglichst erfolgreich am Markt zu sein.",{"text":25881,"start":15860,"end":15941},"Wenn die sich jetzt alle zusammenschließen würden und sagen würden, ja, lass uns das mal irgendwie, ne, vernünftig gemeinsam machen, dann hätten wir als Menschheit wahrscheinlich mehr davon, aber so hat's halt noch nie funktioniert.",{"text":25883,"start":15941,"end":16059},"Und auf der einen Seite treibt es natürlich auch die Innovation voran, ne, dass es möglichst schnell irgendwie sich weiterentwickeln muss und man da deswegen auch, also dass der Mit der Grund ist, dass wir halt diese rasante Weiterentwicklung haben, weil all die Milliarden irgendwie da reingegossen werden.",{"text":25885,"start":16061,"end":16108},"Und wahrscheinlich musst Du dann irgendwie so selbst sein den den das kleinste Übel für dich selbst irgendwie rausfinden.",{"sentences":25887,"speaker":105,"num_words":25898,"start":16112,"end":16605},[25888,25890,25892,25894,25896],{"text":25889,"start":16112,"end":16140},"Und ich mein, es gibt halt auch noch die Extreme, ne.",{"text":25891,"start":16140,"end":16274},"Ich würd's auch noch nie hier so diskutiert, also deshalb irgendwie ja, bei bei Musk, von dem ich vor, man, Kameras draus, 16 Jahren, ne, irgendwie 'n großer, was heißt 'n großer Fan war, weil ich fand das schon irgendwo über sehr lange Zeit sehr beeindruckend.",{"text":25893,"start":16277,"end":16327},"Ich hab das sehr nah verfolgt, alles, was er so gemacht hat und hab mir gedacht, okay, Wahnsinn, ne.",{"text":25895,"start":16327,"end":16525},"Wie wie kann 1 das so irgendwie parallel, ist man unabhängig, wie viele davon wirklich irgendwie selbst gemacht hat, aber es drehte sich halt einfach sehr viel seine Person und er hat sehr, sehr viel bewegt und und war da total begeistert vor und dann dann fragst Du dich, wie kann jemand, ne, so irgendwie, weiß ich nicht, abrutschen oder in in ins Falsche, ja, abdrehen und dann in hinten die falschen Kontakte irgendwie kommen.",{"text":25897,"start":16525,"end":16605},"Und irgendwie ist es ja auch natürlich, ich mein, ich mein, wenn Du dir Wie sollst Du wie sollst Du normal bleiben, wenn Du der reichste Mensch der Welt bist, so?",182,{"sentences":25900,"speaker":105,"num_words":25911,"start":16605,"end":16810},[25901,25903,25905,25907,25909],{"text":25902,"start":16605,"end":16647},"Also da da brauchst Du irgendwie besondere besondere Grundlagen irgendwie, dass dass das passiert.",{"text":25904,"start":16647,"end":16663},"Und Du kannst ja wirklich Sachen machen.",{"text":25906,"start":16663,"end":16723},"Ich mein, Du Du bist dann je näher, die die, ne, die die erste, keine Ahnung, das erste Mal eine Rakete wieder aufgefangen hat.",{"text":25908,"start":16723,"end":16761},"Also Du bist natürlich das nicht, aber halt irgendwie die Unternehmen, für die Du dich verantwortlich zeichnest.",{"text":25910,"start":16765,"end":16810},"Und dass Du da irgendwann dann halt, ja, bisschen gaga wirst, das kann ich schon irgendwie auch nachvollziehen.",80,{"sentences":25913,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":16810,"end":16816},[25914],{"text":25915,"start":16810,"end":16816},"Ich würd",{"sentences":25917,"speaker":105,"num_words":24969,"start":16816,"end":16838},[25918],{"text":25919,"start":16816,"end":16838},"dir Und so ähnlich ist es wahrscheinlich auch.",{"sentences":25921,"speaker":325,"num_words":25032,"start":16842,"end":16890},[25922],{"text":25923,"start":16842,"end":16890},"Auslux mit Elon Musk war einfach so, oh, ich hab den ja nicht schon da eigentlich gemacht.",{"sentences":25925,"speaker":125,"num_words":24969,"start":16890,"end":16914},[25926],{"text":25927,"start":16890,"end":16914},"Eigentlich mehr so zu Dennis' persönlicher Reise gegangen.",{"sentences":25929,"speaker":325,"num_words":25937,"start":16919,"end":17007},[25930,25932,25933,25935],{"text":25931,"start":16919,"end":16949},"Ach wisst ihr auch, Blau ist by the way meine Lieblingsfarbe.",{"text":16957,"start":16953,"end":16954},{"text":25934,"start":16954,"end":16971},"Genau, aber jetzt aber den Übergang.",{"text":25936,"start":16971,"end":17007},"Genug Kontext zu Elon Musk und dann und so ähnlich ist es auch Ja,",32,{"sentences":25939,"speaker":105,"num_words":25950,"start":17007,"end":17399},[25940,25942,25944,25946,25948],{"text":25941,"start":17007,"end":17163},"genau, also und da ist es irgendwie dann so der für uns jetzt hier in, ja, ist für viele, glaube ich, in Deutschland und so ist es da irgendwie sone harte oder eine klare Grenze, wo man irgendwann gesagt hat, okay, das geht uns dann zu weit mit, ne, Trump Support und im und in der Regierung sitzen und so was.",{"text":25943,"start":17165,"end":17234},"Und da meine ich nur, da muss wahrscheinlich jeder für sich irgendwo halt diese Grenzen irgendwie ausloten und sagen, okay, ab wann ist es was, wo es mich stört.",{"text":25945,"start":17234,"end":17272},"Ab wann ist es halt irgendwie unterliegen und mit dem wir uns irgendwie zurechtfinden müssen.",{"text":25947,"start":17272,"end":17291},"Das muss man ja auf Unternehmensweise auch.",{"text":25949,"start":17291,"end":17399},"Ich mein, kann man jetzt Clayd oder OpenAI boykottieren einfach nur aus diesen Gründen oder ist der Schaden dann für die eigene Firma auch wieder so groß, weil man halt nicht das das Beste und die die die größten Modelle nutzt so?",154,{"sentences":25952,"speaker":125,"num_words":25566,"start":17401,"end":17525},[25953,25955,25957,25959,25961],{"text":25954,"start":17401,"end":17433},"Ich musste mich, ich ich war hart an den Batman Film erinnert.",{"text":25956,"start":17433,"end":17463},"Jetzt weiß leider nicht, in welchem von der Trilogie das war.",{"text":25958,"start":17463,"end":17485},"Ich glaub eine Dark Knight Rights.",{"text":25960,"start":17489,"end":17500},"Wenn er sagt, so.",{"text":25962,"start":17504,"end":17525},"So gefühlt verhalten sich ja diese ganzen Airi Labs.",{"sentences":25964,"speaker":125,"num_words":25975,"start":17525,"end":17755},[25965,25967,25969,25971,25973],{"text":25966,"start":17525,"end":17595},"So die starten alle superoptimistisch und irgendwann, wie Du schon sagst, ne, treffen sich halt auch sone sone harte Realität, mit der sie halt irgendwie Mhm.",{"text":25968,"start":17598,"end":17602},"Umgehen müssen.",{"text":25970,"start":17604,"end":17662},"Was ja vielleicht aber auch gar nicht so schlimm wäre, wenn sie sich das vorher gar nicht so stark auf die Banner geschrieben hätten, ja.",{"text":25972,"start":17662,"end":17678},"Also dadurch entsteht ja dieser Kontrast.",{"text":25974,"start":17681,"end":17755},"Und ich glaube, das macht auch sone Unterschied aus zu dem, was Du grade selber sagtest, dann hör mal zu zu Facebook, zu Google Cloud Hosting zu, keine Ahnung, ne.",89,{"sentences":25977,"speaker":125,"num_words":25984,"start":17755,"end":17921},[25978,25980,25982],{"text":25979,"start":17755,"end":17815},"Google Cloud Hosting ist nie gestartet mit, wir sind hier, weil wir 'n moralischen Kompass haben und die Welt besser machen wollen, so, ja.",{"text":25981,"start":17818,"end":17850},"Und und scheitern dann daran, sondern die sind halt 'n relativ transparentes Unternehmen, so.",{"text":25983,"start":17850,"end":17921},"Natürlich hat Google irgendwann mal so ganz, ganz früher mit Do No Evil und so was angefangen, aber das ist ja schon, also das das glaubt, glaube ich,",66,{"sentences":25986,"speaker":105,"num_words":25141,"start":17921,"end":18046},[25987,25989,25990,25992,25994],{"text":25988,"start":17921,"end":17926},"keiner mehr.",{"text":25602,"start":17926,"end":17931},{"text":25991,"start":17931,"end":17978},"Aber ja, richtig, richtig, aber das, ey, ich mein, da kannst Du doch die gleiche Geschichte auch erzählen.",{"text":25993,"start":17978,"end":18023},"Ich mein, irgendwo haben sie das doch genauso gesagt und wollten die Welt seine Besserung und Apple doch auch.",{"text":25995,"start":18023,"end":18046},"Ich mein, die sehen sich doch schon auch als Weltverbesserer.",{"sentences":25997,"speaker":325,"num_words":24863,"start":18049,"end":18063},[25998],{"text":25999,"start":18049,"end":18063},"Aber na ja und und die die",{"sentences":26001,"speaker":125,"num_words":25566,"start":18063,"end":18177},[26002,26004,26006,26008,26010],{"text":26003,"start":18063,"end":18093},"haben halt immerhin ehrlicherweise dann mit diesem AI Shit aufgehört, ne.",{"text":26005,"start":18093,"end":18151},"So, die haben gesagt, so so wie wir das haben wollen würden, unseren Ansprüchen gerecht zu werden, so kriegen wir das nicht gebaut.",{"text":26007,"start":18151,"end":18160},"Ja, Ja.",{"text":26009,"start":18164,"end":18171},"Schalten wir nicht.",{"text":26011,"start":18171,"end":18177},"Ist ja so.",{"sentences":26013,"speaker":125,"num_words":105,"start":18177,"end":18179},[26014],{"text":9029,"start":18177,"end":18179},{"sentences":26016,"speaker":105,"num_words":325,"start":18179,"end":18185},[26017],{"text":26018,"start":18179,"end":18185},"Ja, wir",{"sentences":26020,"speaker":125,"num_words":25777,"start":18185,"end":18416},[26021,26023,26025,26027,26029],{"text":26022,"start":18185,"end":18248},"wir können kein Siri bauen, was Privatsphäre so respektiert, was was nicht halluziniert, unseren Ansprüchen gerecht zu werden, dann lassen wir's lieber.",{"text":26024,"start":18251,"end":18270},"Das ist ja auch irgendwie eine Alternative, ja.",{"text":26026,"start":18273,"end":18349},"Und das meine ich halt so, diese diese diese Diskrepanz zwischen Anspruch und Möglichkeit, das ist, glaube ich, das, was für mich so frustrierend ist und gar nicht dieses kapitalistisch.",{"text":26028,"start":18353,"end":18386},"Also ich mein, da muss man sich ja überhaupt keine Illusion hingeben, Mhm.",{"text":26030,"start":18388,"end":18416},"Dass hier nicht jeder Player auch Teil dieses Systems ist, so.",{"sentences":26032,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":18416,"end":18431},[26033,26034],{"text":665,"start":18416,"end":18418},{"text":26035,"start":18418,"end":18431},"Aber halt auch bei Apple",{"sentences":26037,"speaker":105,"num_words":25468,"start":18431,"end":18592},[26038],{"text":26039,"start":18431,"end":18592},"ist es natürlich eine Lücke mit irgendwie Privacy und Datenschutz und so was, die sie natürlich marketingtechnisch irgendwann, ne, wo sie gemerkt haben, also da waren sie halt sehr, sehr schlau, sehr früh, aber dass das 'n Ding wird und haben halt dadurch aber mit Sicherheit auch aus Business Perspektive so, ne, dass das was ist, womit man Geld machen kann, auf Privatsphäre zu setzen.",{"sentences":26041,"speaker":325,"num_words":26044,"start":18595,"end":18646},[26042],{"text":26043,"start":18595,"end":18646},"Aber was mich jetzt an der Stelle interessieren würde, ich sag's dir, Jan oder Dennis, wie war das eigentlich bei Elon Musk,",22,{"sentences":26046,"speaker":125,"num_words":456,"start":18649,"end":18658},[26047],{"text":26048,"start":18649,"end":18658},"Eigentlich Elon Musks",{"sentences":26050,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":18662,"end":18669},[26051,26052],{"text":18666,"start":18662,"end":18663},{"text":717,"start":18668,"end":18669},{"sentences":26054,"speaker":125,"num_words":24758,"start":18669,"end":18680},[26055],{"text":26056,"start":18669,"end":18680},"ist doch Genau, genau.",{"sentences":26058,"speaker":325,"num_words":25407,"start":18680,"end":18964},[26059,26061,26063,26065,26067],{"text":26060,"start":18680,"end":18764},"Und zwar aber, also weil Du's grade so gesagt hast, so von wegen, ja, Google schreibt sich das nicht auf die Fahne, aber propagieren oder haben das diese AI Unternehmen davor so krass propagiert?",{"text":26062,"start":18768,"end":18840},"Son Entropic oder auch son Mystereier, dass die gesagt haben, ja, ja, wir sind die Weltwörter, sondern wir machen das auf eine gute Art und Weise.",{"text":26064,"start":18840,"end":18880},"Also ich hatte eher das Gefühl, die wurden halt einfach so Drive by sympathisch, ne.",{"text":26066,"start":18880,"end":18928},"Also irgendwie so, ja, wir, ne, Entropic, die gesagt haben, wir wollen nicht, dass das für militärische Zwecke benutzt wird.",{"text":26068,"start":18928,"end":18964},"Also das haben die aus freien Städte, ja irgendwie so bisschen gesagt.",{"sentences":26070,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":18967,"end":18981},[26071],{"text":26072,"start":18967,"end":18981},"Haben die sich wirklich so positioniert?",{"sentences":26074,"speaker":105,"num_words":456,"start":18981,"end":18989},[26075],{"text":26076,"start":18981,"end":18989},"Also das ist",{"sentences":26078,"speaker":325,"num_words":25304,"start":18989,"end":19033},[26079,26081,26083,26085],{"text":26080,"start":18989,"end":19001},"ja die Frage, ja.",{"text":26082,"start":19004,"end":19009},"Ja, okay.",{"text":26084,"start":19009,"end":19015},"Dann Nein.",{"text":26086,"start":19019,"end":19033},"Ich hasse nicht übernehmen, nein.",{"sentences":26088,"speaker":125,"num_words":24863,"start":19035,"end":19054},[26089],{"text":26090,"start":19035,"end":19054},"Okay, genug Aber ich fand der E-Roll.",{"sentences":26092,"speaker":105,"num_words":325,"start":19058,"end":19062},[26093],{"text":26094,"start":19058,"end":19062},"Nein, wirklich",{"sentences":26096,"speaker":325,"num_words":24969,"start":19064,"end":19085},[26097],{"text":26098,"start":19064,"end":19085},"Wann nehmen wir das Elon Musk Special auf.",{"sentences":26100,"speaker":105,"num_words":26107,"start":19085,"end":19283},[26101,26103,26105],{"text":26102,"start":19085,"end":19216},"Ich weiß nicht mehr genau, wie diese Zeiten waren, aber so ich hab wirklich, fast alle Präsentationen so was geguckt, weil ich das einfach, ich fand, der hat die Welt so irgendwie, ich fand, der hat die Welt schön erklärt, so als es diese ersten Solasachen gab und so was.",{"text":26104,"start":19216,"end":19276},"Und sonst hörte sich so alles sinnvoll und hey, wir können das machen und das ist alles, dann fixen wir das und alles gut und so.",{"text":26106,"start":19276,"end":19283},"Es war Ist",79,{"sentences":26109,"speaker":125,"num_words":24778,"start":19283,"end":19323},[26110,26112],{"text":26111,"start":19283,"end":19316},"ist die erste Frage ist doch Dennis, warum hast Du nie 'n Tesla gehabt?",{"text":26113,"start":19319,"end":19323},"Bis jetzt.",{"sentences":26115,"speaker":105,"num_words":25777,"start":19326,"end":19541},[26116,26118,26120,26121,26123],{"text":26117,"start":19326,"end":19401},"Nee, weil sie, ja, jetzt schließe ich's ja aus, aber weil sie mir zu lange noch zu teuer waren und ich nicht so viel Geld für 'n Auto ausgeben wollte.",{"text":26119,"start":19401,"end":19478},"Also ich konnte es mir in dem Sinne noch nicht leisten und dann war der Moment, vorbei auf die Eltern, die ich mir gegangen bist, wo ich's hätte machen können.",{"text":665,"start":19478,"end":19480},{"text":26122,"start":19480,"end":19490},"Aber ja, ist krass.",{"text":26124,"start":19490,"end":19541},"Also ich mein, ja, ich hab es jahrelang gefeiert und da geht das Update verfolgt so, was das angeht.",{"sentences":26126,"speaker":325,"num_words":24778,"start":19545,"end":19585},[26127,26128,26130],{"text":665,"start":19545,"end":19546},{"text":26129,"start":19546,"end":19576},"Aber ich bin nicht gefragt, ist der Musk überhaupt 'n guter Speaker?",{"text":26131,"start":19576,"end":19585},"Weißt Du jetzt,",{"sentences":26133,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":19588,"end":19599},[26134],{"text":26135,"start":19588,"end":19599},"guck ich mir die chinesischen",{"sentences":26137,"speaker":325,"num_words":26148,"start":19602,"end":19757},[26138,26140,26142,26144,26146],{"text":26139,"start":19602,"end":19608},"Euros an.",{"text":26141,"start":19608,"end":19688},"Ja, also der der fühlt es richtig und der kann das mit Überzeugung rüberbringen und sag, hey, guck mal, das ist das geilste Ding, was ich in der Handhaber so der Welt so.",{"text":26143,"start":19688,"end":19713},"Es gibt nichts Krasseres als dieses iPhone hier so.",{"text":26145,"start":19713,"end":19742},"Das fand ich schon bei Steve Jobs irgendwie ganz cool so.",{"text":26147,"start":19742,"end":19757},"Das kam auch sehr authentisch drüber.",61,{"sentences":26150,"speaker":325,"num_words":25692,"start":19757,"end":19835},[26151,26153],{"text":26152,"start":19757,"end":19805},"Bei Musk, ich hab nur so, glaub ich, eine Präsentation, die macht mir so, ja, es ist okay.",{"text":26154,"start":19805,"end":19835},"So, ich weiß nicht, er hat mir irgendwie als als Er war",{"sentences":26156,"speaker":105,"num_words":24749,"start":19835,"end":19884},[26157,26159,26161],{"text":26158,"start":19835,"end":19859},"kein, nein, der war kein ja, ja und nein.",{"text":26160,"start":19859,"end":19872},"Also er war kein guter Speaker.",{"text":26162,"start":19872,"end":19884},"Er ist kein guter Speaker,",{"sentences":26164,"speaker":125,"num_words":24727,"start":19884,"end":19899},[26165],{"text":26166,"start":19884,"end":19899},"aber er ist 'n guter Nerd.",{"sentences":26168,"speaker":105,"num_words":26171,"start":19902,"end":19962},[26169],{"text":26170,"start":19902,"end":19962},"Ja und aber Du hast ihn dadurch das noch mal so mehr abgekauft, dass er halt darüber so nachgedacht hat und gesagt hat, ja, machen wir",26,{"sentences":26173,"speaker":125,"num_words":325,"start":19962,"end":19967},[26174],{"text":26175,"start":19962,"end":19967},"das so.",{"sentences":26177,"speaker":105,"num_words":26188,"start":19967,"end":20103},[26178,26180,26182,26184,26186],{"text":26179,"start":19967,"end":19984},"Er war so auch in diesen Präsentationen.",{"text":26181,"start":19984,"end":20027},"Du warst halt irgendwie, das hörte sich sehr sinnvoll und sehr bar an, so, was er gesagt hat.",{"text":26183,"start":20029,"end":20051},"Natürlich war er nicht so shiny und vorbereitet, ne.",{"text":26185,"start":20051,"end":20077},"Es war ihm alles verspätet, das war und so weiter.",{"text":26187,"start":20077,"end":20103},"Es war also, was die Präsentationsthemen angeht, ja.",52,{"sentences":26190,"speaker":105,"num_words":26199,"start":20106,"end":20218},[26191,26193,26194,26196,26198],{"text":26192,"start":20106,"end":20121},"Vielleicht zu dem, was Apple gemacht hat.",{"text":665,"start":20121,"end":20124},{"text":26195,"start":20127,"end":20175},"Aber trotzdem einfach von den Ideen so, dass Du dachtest so, das ist, so geht das sehr easy.",{"text":26197,"start":20175,"end":20213},"Klar, schließen wir unsere Kabel im Kopf an und fahren dann autonom besser.",{"text":20220,"start":20217,"end":20218},40,{"sentences":26201,"speaker":125,"num_words":24822,"start":20222,"end":20252},[26202,26203,26204],{"text":20225,"start":20222,"end":20223},{"text":1771,"start":20223,"end":20227},{"text":26205,"start":20229,"end":20252},"Die Folge noch mal 'n bisschen positiv zu drehen, lassen",{"sentences":26207,"speaker":325,"num_words":456,"start":20252,"end":20261},[26208],{"text":26209,"start":20252,"end":20261},"wir dir bitte.",{"sentences":26211,"speaker":125,"num_words":25295,"start":20265,"end":20296},[26212,26214,26216],{"text":26213,"start":20265,"end":20271},"Dir bitte.",{"text":26215,"start":20274,"end":20293},"Was zu den Designer Walls erzählen.",{"text":353,"start":20295,"end":20296},{"sentences":26218,"speaker":105,"num_words":24872,"start":20299,"end":20345},[26219,26221,26223,26225,26227],{"text":26220,"start":20299,"end":20305},"Das auch noch.",{"text":26222,"start":20305,"end":20314},"Haben wir nicht gesagt?",{"text":26224,"start":20314,"end":20323},"Das Thema was?",{"text":26226,"start":20323,"end":20332},"Hast Du gesagt?",{"text":26228,"start":20332,"end":20345},"Das ist eine kurze Folge.",{"sentences":26230,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":20345,"end":20359},[26231],{"text":26232,"start":20345,"end":20359},"Was steht auf dem Regal?",{"sentences":26234,"speaker":125,"num_words":325,"start":20359,"end":20368},[26235],{"text":26236,"start":20359,"end":20368},"Echt, nein.",{"sentences":26238,"speaker":105,"num_words":24742,"start":20368,"end":20384},[26239],{"text":26240,"start":20368,"end":20384},"Ach, 'n neues Ach, mal.",{"sentences":26242,"speaker":325,"num_words":24872,"start":20384,"end":20433},[26243,26245,26246],{"text":26244,"start":20384,"end":20413},"Deswegen ist ja immer gesagt, es wird die kürzeste Folge ever.",{"text":9029,"start":20413,"end":20415},{"text":26247,"start":20417,"end":20433},"Dave hat's halt gegen weich falsch.",{"sentences":26249,"speaker":125,"num_words":24924,"start":20436,"end":20458},[26250],{"text":26251,"start":20436,"end":20458},"Das sollte man halt einfach vor der Aufnahme nicht sagen.",{"sentences":26253,"speaker":325,"num_words":26171,"start":20460,"end":20525},[26254,26255],{"text":665,"start":20460,"end":20461},{"text":26256,"start":20461,"end":20525},"Na ja, deswegen weiß ich nicht mehr, ich bin einzige, der also 'n Thema vorbereitet hat so und ihr nicht zu sehen, dass ich mir",{"sentences":26258,"speaker":125,"num_words":24863,"start":20527,"end":20549},[26259,26261,26262,26263],{"text":26260,"start":20527,"end":20533},"Ich war vorbereitet.",{"text":20538,"start":20535,"end":20536},{"text":20544,"start":20540,"end":20541},{"text":25442,"start":20541,"end":20549},{"sentences":26265,"speaker":325,"num_words":25304,"start":20549,"end":20583},[26266,26268,26270,26272,26273],{"text":26267,"start":20549,"end":20560},"das ist ja son Gedankenspiel.",{"text":26269,"start":20563,"end":20567},"Ja, doch.",{"text":26271,"start":20567,"end":20577},"Das ist schon okay.",{"text":665,"start":20577,"end":20579},{"text":20585,"start":20582,"end":20583},{"sentences":26275,"speaker":325,"num_words":24742,"start":20587,"end":20598},[26276],{"text":26277,"start":20587,"end":20598},"Was ist das denn überhaupt?",{"sentences":26279,"speaker":456,"num_words":325,"start":20598,"end":20605},[26280],{"text":26281,"start":20598,"end":20605},"Ja, ja.",{"sentences":26283,"speaker":105,"num_words":25342,"start":20605,"end":20870},[26284,26286,26288,26290,26292],{"text":26285,"start":20605,"end":20613},"Was sind die?",{"text":26287,"start":20613,"end":20769},"Jedes Jahr zur WWDC verkündet Apple so, es gibt aus verschiedenen Kategorien Apps, die wir vorher nominiert haben und dann gibt es die Gewinner und da geht's eben darum, es geht unterschiedliche Kategorien und dort nutzen dann diese Apps im in der Regel halt irgendwo die technischen Innovationen des Apple Ökosystems bestmöglich aus.",{"text":26289,"start":20769,"end":20800},"Das ist halt natürlich auch son bisschen auf die eigene Schulter klopfen.",{"text":26291,"start":20800,"end":20816},"Guck mal, was wir alles können.",{"text":26293,"start":20818,"end":20870},"Guck mal, was die Entwickler*innen da draußen alles mit unseren tollen Frameworks machen können und das schaukesen wir dann Mhm.",{"sentences":26295,"speaker":105,"num_words":25032,"start":20873,"end":20918},[26296,26298],{"text":26297,"start":20873,"end":20878},"Und zeigen das.",{"text":26299,"start":20878,"end":20918},"Und es gibt dieses Jahr 6 verschiedene Kategorien, die anfangen bei Delight and Fun.",{"sentences":26301,"speaker":325,"num_words":24969,"start":20922,"end":20941},[26302,26304],{"text":26303,"start":20922,"end":20929},"Das sind wir.",{"text":26305,"start":20932,"end":20941},"Wir sind Delight and Fun.",{"sentences":26307,"speaker":105,"num_words":24910,"start":20943,"end":21093},[26308,26310,26312,26314,26316],{"text":26309,"start":20943,"end":20974},"Und also, ne, sie sagen so was wie, bei Apple Technologies, ne.",{"text":26311,"start":20974,"end":21027},"Also Du willst, wenn Du da gewinnen willst, musst Du schon so den maximalen Apple Weg, am besten keine Android App.",{"text":26313,"start":21031,"end":21052},"Von Apple Watch bis alles, keine Ahnung was.",{"text":26315,"start":21052,"end":21076},"Was weißt Du, das neueste, größte, letzte?",{"text":26317,"start":21079,"end":21093},"Früher wusste ich das alles, ja.",{"sentences":26319,"speaker":325,"num_words":24758,"start":21093,"end":21106},[26320,26322],{"text":26321,"start":21093,"end":21099},"Was denn?",{"text":26323,"start":21099,"end":21106},"Was Größte?",{"sentences":26325,"speaker":105,"num_words":24815,"start":21110,"end":21157},[26326],{"text":26327,"start":21110,"end":21157},"Irgendwas Cooles, was nur Apple irgendwie, wo sie sagen, wahrscheinlich hier so diesen Kamerabutton oder so wie es so.",{"sentences":26329,"speaker":125,"num_words":25710,"start":21157,"end":21221},[26330,26331,26333],{"text":21162,"start":21157,"end":21160},{"text":26332,"start":21164,"end":21170},"Ach so, Kamerabutton.",{"text":26334,"start":21173,"end":21221},"Na ja, ich hatte jetzt grad so Vision OS ist auch immer noch son Thema Genau, ja, ja, genau,",{"sentences":26336,"speaker":105,"num_words":26339,"start":21221,"end":21307},[26337],{"text":26338,"start":21221,"end":21307},"da wär ich da irgendwo reinkommen, aber so was wie das halt den Hardware Button da an der Seite jetzt ordentlich nutzt und da eine coole Experience aus diesem, weil es halt nur Ah,",34,{"sentences":26341,"speaker":325,"num_words":25937,"start":21307,"end":21393},[26342],{"text":26343,"start":21307,"end":21393},"weil Du weil Du weil es ja auch so sensitiv ist und damit könntest Du ja auch 'n spielerisches Element machen, indem Du halt die Kamera unterdrück drückst und Ja, ja, okay.",{"sentences":26345,"speaker":105,"num_words":24772,"start":21395,"end":21457},[26346,26347,26349],{"text":11763,"start":21395,"end":21396},{"text":26348,"start":21396,"end":21432},"Und dann gibt es immer jetzt halt dann iOS, Vision OS und Mac OS.",{"text":26350,"start":21436,"end":21457},"Ich weiß nicht, ob das immer so ist in iPad.",{"sentences":26352,"speaker":325,"num_words":24787,"start":21457,"end":21496},[26353,26355,26356],{"text":26354,"start":21457,"end":21483},"Und wahrscheinlich auch Watch OS, iPad OS, TV OS.",{"text":4254,"start":21483,"end":21486},{"text":26357,"start":21486,"end":21496},"Die ganzen Sachen, oder?",{"sentences":26359,"speaker":105,"num_words":24749,"start":21496,"end":21548},[26360,26361,26362,26364],{"text":26281,"start":21496,"end":21501},{"text":11763,"start":21503,"end":21504},{"text":26363,"start":21504,"end":21545},"Und wenn es dann natürlich auf unterschiedlichen Plattformen geht, ist das natürlich auch noch mal cool.",{"text":21549,"start":21547,"end":21548},{"sentences":26366,"speaker":456,"num_words":105,"start":21551,"end":21552},[26367],{"text":2827,"start":21551,"end":21552},{"sentences":26369,"speaker":105,"num_words":24720,"start":21552,"end":21656},[26370,26372],{"text":26371,"start":21552,"end":21587},"man schon sagen, da sind Apps, die sich halt also ne, die sich cool anfühlen.",{"text":26373,"start":21587,"end":21656},"Von daher, die mal an zu ist immer son ganz guter, da will man mal coole Apps sehen, was so State of the Art, was App Design angeht.",{"sentences":26375,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":21656,"end":21663},[26376],{"text":26377,"start":21656,"end":21663},"Nee oder",{"sentences":26379,"speaker":105,"num_words":24863,"start":21663,"end":21682},[26380,26381],{"text":992,"start":21663,"end":21666},{"text":26382,"start":21669,"end":21682},"Also kann man da mal rein.",{"sentences":26384,"speaker":325,"num_words":26394,"start":21682,"end":21840},[26385,26387,26389,26390,26392],{"text":26386,"start":21682,"end":21718},"Nee, mal State of the Art, sondern ich hab 'n paar Reihen gesprochen.",{"text":26388,"start":21718,"end":21783},"Ich find, die sind manchmal so einfach so einfach so einfach so cool, so irgendwie so, oh, das hatte ich bisher noch nicht erlebt in soner App.",{"text":665,"start":21783,"end":21785},{"text":26391,"start":21785,"end":21818},"Und das war irgendwie cool, so einfach so, was was kann man denn theoretisch machen?",{"text":26393,"start":21818,"end":21840},"Und ich also ich find schon sehr interessant.",64,{"sentences":26396,"speaker":125,"num_words":26406,"start":21843,"end":22060},[26397,26399,26401,26402,26404],{"text":26398,"start":21843,"end":21870},"Da mal eine Lanze für Lotum und die Programmierbar zu brechen.",{"text":26400,"start":21870,"end":21896},"1 der Nominierten ist Ist die Programmier App.",{"text":19017,"start":21899,"end":21900},{"text":26403,"start":21902,"end":21996},"Ist aber ein, den Sven hier schon mal vorgestellt hat, als er zu Gast war und wir über Game Development und die Devcom und die Gamescom und so was alles gesprochen haben, da war das sein Pick.",{"text":26405,"start":21999,"end":22060},"Und er hat schon irgendwie damals 'n coolen Pitch für das Spiel gemacht und offensichtlich hat Apple ihm zugehört und ihm deshalb Hat das 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sagen.",{"text":665,"start":22306,"end":22309},{"sentences":26449,"speaker":105,"num_words":24872,"start":22311,"end":22352},[26450,26452],{"text":26451,"start":22311,"end":22319},"Das ist richtig.",{"text":26453,"start":22319,"end":22352},"Also ich bin ziemlich sicher, dass wir uns nicht besonders qualifizieren für die Apple Designer.",{"sentences":26455,"speaker":325,"num_words":24727,"start":22352,"end":22374},[26456,26458],{"text":26457,"start":22352,"end":22360},"Noch nicht.",{"text":26459,"start":22363,"end":22374},"Growth Mindset, noch nicht.",{"sentences":26461,"speaker":105,"num_words":24986,"start":22376,"end":22455},[26462,26464,26466,26468,26469],{"text":26463,"start":22376,"end":22383},"Also, pass auf.",{"text":26465,"start":22383,"end":22400},"Wir machen spontan ein Gewinnspiel da draus.",{"text":26467,"start":22400,"end":22409},"Wir haben die Kategorien.",{"text":9029,"start":22412,"end":22413},{"text":26470,"start":22416,"end":22455},"Und da ist dann jeweils noch mal unterschieden nach Apps und Games in jeweils diesen Kategorien.",{"sentences":26472,"speaker":105,"num_words":24778,"start":22457,"end":22500},[26473,26475,26477],{"text":26474,"start":22457,"end":22489},"Das heißt, am Ende wird es summar summarum 12 unterschiedliche Apps geben.",{"text":26476,"start":22491,"end":22494},"Die gewinnen.",{"text":26476,"start":22497,"end":22500},{"sentences":26479,"speaker":325,"num_words":105,"start":22502,"end":22503},[26480],{"text":9029,"start":22502,"end":22503},{"sentences":26482,"speaker":105,"num_words":24772,"start":22506,"end":22570},[26483,26485,26487],{"text":26484,"start":22506,"end":22531},"Ich korrigier jetzt grad noch mal das, was ich grade ankünd.",{"text":26486,"start":22535,"end":22556},"Das ist ja schon ganz schön viel, 12 Apps.",{"text":26488,"start":22559,"end":22570},"Ich wollte eigentlich sagen 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der",27,{"sentences":26512,"speaker":325,"num_words":325,"start":22677,"end":22683},[26513,26514],{"text":22680,"start":22677,"end":22678},{"text":22680,"start":22682,"end":22683},{"sentences":26516,"speaker":105,"num_words":24720,"start":22685,"end":22801},[26517,26519,26521,26523],{"text":26518,"start":22685,"end":22707},"Der Gewinner uns schreibt an Programmier, an wo?",{"text":26520,"start":22707,"end":22715},"An Gewinnspiel.",{"text":26522,"start":22715,"end":22762},"Nein, an Podcast at Programmier Punkt Bar oder über eine Kontaktformular auf der Webseite und schreibt, wenn es funktioniert.",{"text":26524,"start":22764,"end":22801},"Dann ist der oder diejenige in einem Lospott, ich kann nicht mehr reden, Lospott.",{"sentences":26526,"speaker":325,"num_words":24969,"start":22806,"end":22830},[26527,26528,26530],{"text":22810,"start":22806,"end":22807},{"text":26529,"start":22812,"end":22823},"Nein, Pott ist okay.",{"text":26531,"start":22823,"end":22830},"Ich wir 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